Why so difficult?

If you are referring as why the price of GS has changed/ updated in the last 12hr, its because worldwide precious metal market is closed.

With perth mint, if you buy directly, the postage will be close to $50 and there is no guarantee when your order is fulfilled. Since you are in Melbourne, you can pick up from GS office.
 
Steve19800 said:
DanielM said:
Steve19800 said:
Hello spannermonkey,

Thanks for your reply.
I'm in Melbourne, Victoria. I put perth mint in the search box, hoping for some reviews but this thread came out, in fact it seems there is very limited review about PM, even on google. No doubt it is internationally recognised company for more than 200 years but reviews are extremely rare, it's a bit odd. Or am I missing something? I know there are numbers of gold dealers but how can I be sure which one is good? Thanks.
Click to expand...

If your in Melbourne, goldstackers are good, I think they have very fair prices and they have a secure office with friendly staff where you can walk in and make purchases
Click to expand...

Thanks for your recommendation.
But do you think goldstackers prices for silver bar is a bit high? I notice Perth mint gold/silver bar prices are updated daily but not goldstackers? Am I missing something? Thanks.
Click to expand...


Yes, you are missing the very good and sensible advice you are receiving.

Perth Mint price may seem cheaper than a Dealers, but add on postage and insurance and it most likely isnt.
 
Steve19800 said:
@spannermonkey
How do you eventually recognise some are real and some are not? You experienced it before?
Click to expand...

Heaps of ways, magnet, acid, gravity, ultrasonic thickness testing. Look and feel, Weight, toning, tarnish. In this case research, experience heaps also Google is you friend
 
Prices on Gold Stackers website update every five minutes during business hours.

The Perth Mint does not provide wholesale discounts on their silver bars anywhere close to the discounts that are available on minted products to dustributors, so the prices are higher, but I think you will find us easier to deal with :)
 
EasyCollective,
but you don't bring all those tools with you when you purchase a gold/silver right. Don't want to sound paranoid but does it make any sense if there is always chance counterfeited bars/coins are circulated in the market? So why it seems like we should not put our concern on this matter? Can I assume that for example, first purchaser buy from a dealer based on trust only?

Thanks goldpelican,
There are several silver coin/bar brands e.g. PAMP, Scottsdale, PM, SBA, etc. 10 oz Regal Metals Cast Silver Bar is made of pure silver so is 10 oz Perth Mint Cast Silver Bar. Why the price is different?
If the buyer want to sell it in the future, does the potential buyer even care about the brand?

Regarding the closed market,
PM 10 oz closed at $329.90 while GS at $341.90. Is it possible to get the PM price? What silver/gold manufactured by GS?
 
Steve19800 said:
@spannermonkey
How do you eventually recognise some are real and some are not? You experienced it before?
Click to expand...

When you've fondled enough bars
" You get a feel for " ;)

I don't carry anything with me , the dealers that buy back are so paranoid about fakes & can see them from a mile away .

If you don't have enough trust in the dealers

IF I WERE YOU , I WOULDN'T TOUCH THE BULLION GAME ;)
It really is that simple
I bought 2 fake coins from a dealer , I found out they were fakes & had my cash back in my pocket with in hours
And now NOBODY visits that dealer any more ;)

Trust me :D I'm on first name basis with all the dealers in the CBD :D
And I work at one of the dealerships doing they're eBay store ;)
 
spannermonkey said:
Trust me :D I'm on first name basis with all the dealers in the CBD :D
And I work at one of the dealerships doing they're eBay store ;)
Click to expand...

First name basis? I tought they all have cutesy nick name for you!
 
bloomst said:
spannermonkey said:
Trust me :D I'm on first name basis with all the dealers in the CBD :D
And I work at one of the dealerships doing they're eBay store ;)
Click to expand...

First name basis? I tought they all have cutesy nick name for you!
Click to expand...

That's only CK's kids who call me
Mr Monkey :lol:
 
spannermonkey said:
bloomst said:
spannermonkey said:
Trust me :D I'm on first name basis with all the dealers in the CBD :D
And I work at one of the dealerships doing they're eBay store ;)
Click to expand...

First name basis? I tought they all have cutesy nick name for you!
Click to expand...

That's only CK's kids who call me
Mr Monkey :lol:
Click to expand...

Not allowed to print the cutesy nick name the grown ups call him. :lol:
 
Steve19800 said:
Thanks goldpelican,
There are several silver coin/bar brands e.g. PAMP, Scottsdale, PM, SBA, etc. 10 oz Regal Metals Cast Silver Bar is made of pure silver so is 10 oz Perth Mint Cast Silver Bar. Why the price is different?
If the buyer want to sell it in the future, does the potential buyer even care about the brand?

Regarding the closed market,
PM 10 oz closed at $329.90 while GS at $341.90. Is it possible to get the PM price? What silver/gold manufactured by GS?
Click to expand...

Different Brand Different Prices. Just like when you buy a Homebrand Products. They are still manufactured by the well known company, but different prices. You'll be surprised who made them.

If you still new to stacking precious metal, I suggest to start reading, Bullion Baron guide/blog is a good start.

GoldStackers is an authorised dealers for a couple different brands.
 
charlief1 said:
Hi, im in the market for some silver 10-20kg, for my superfund. Been getting various quotes/responses from dealers. Some deliver, some dont etc. Some dont care to respond.
It seems like a pretty hard process, I give you money, you send me silver.
Also. Whats with ID requirements etc? Its nothing to do with the Gov, as it varies from place to place.

Any recommendations for someone who delivers insured and is easy to deal with? Looking for around 10kgs of half kilo bars, maybe 10 ounce bars depending on price (I like smaller for liquidity) and I also want to buy 10kgs of 66 50's. Ill take my chance if this doesnt meet regulations, I know people on here are doing the same. In any case its not the dealers responsibility to police.
Thanks
Click to expand...

So you'll take the chance with the ATO that your super fund is non compliant but are paranoid that a bullion dealer that dozens if not hundreds of people on this site alone have delt with may be selling fake bars?
You might want to do alot more reading and research befor taking the plunge into metals.
If the concept that brand recognition, quality of finish and limited mintages are reasons behind price differances in silver pricing needs expalining then I would be sticking to doing more research befor laying down your fiat on an investment that you don't understand yet. IMHO
 
Just keep it simple.

If you are super paranoid, buy straight from the Perth Mint.

If you want legitimate bullion with great prices, buy from bullionbourse.com or goldstackers. You will not need to provide certified documents as long as the price is under 5k for these two (you will for Perth Mint).

If it makes you feel better, buy certicards:

6z92yu.png
 
i wasnt having a go, i was simply stating that as far as i know the silver i am sold by a dealer could be lead that has been painted. i havnt been in the game long enough to know what a real bar feels like and like you said i should not get in the "bullion" game because i dont have the required skills that you obviously have.
on anouther note i now know why most people are not interested in buying gold and silver but prefer shares and property that has governing bodies in place to protect you from obvious fraud.
there is no such protection with regards to bullion dealers as far as i know and i am a newby to stacking
bottom line is i hear alot of whinging on this site about family members rolling their eyes at you when you discuss stacking and MSM not promoting it or downright demonising it. fact is you have just gone out of your way to tell me not to stack as i dont know how to tell the differnece between real and fake bars when i hold it
just saying
 
With the risk of derailing the thread, but comments like "I will take my chances" and I know others do it. Regarding SMSF's is the reason shit like this gets taken away from us. If every man and his dog works on ways of not doing the right thing, and being compliant or trying to hide things. I mean why else would it matter if you don't plan on cheating the system or have something to hide. The whole point of a SMSF is that it is completely transparent. All this does is make the ATO job real easy for them in arguing to take it away.

As it is becoming more mainstream, audits and actions will increase and people acting like this is the exact reason the ATO want to clamp down on SMSF's. Doesn't matter what aspect of life there is always someone who thinks they are different.

Secondly not real smart highlighting you plan to go against what is acceptable for SMSF and transactions and recording. I know I don't give receipts for my sales ? Which MUST accompany all transactions, in the name of the Super fund FWIW.
 
Wow this conversation got sidetracked.

anonmiss said:
charlief1 said:
Hi, im in the market for some silver 10-20kg, for my superfund. Been getting various quotes/responses from dealers. Some deliver, some dont etc. Some dont care to respond.
It seems like a pretty hard process, I give you money, you send me silver.
Also. Whats with ID requirements etc? Its nothing to do with the Gov, as it varies from place to place.

Any recommendations for someone who delivers insured and is easy to deal with? Looking for around 10kgs of half kilo bars, maybe 10 ounce bars depending on price (I like smaller for liquidity) and I also want to buy 10kgs of 66 50's. Ill take my chance if this doesnt meet regulations, I know people on here are doing the same. In any case its not the dealers responsibility to police.
Thanks
Click to expand...

So you'll take the chance with the ATO that your super fund is non compliant but are paranoid that a bullion dealer that dozens if not hundreds of people on this site alone have delt with may be selling fake bars?
You might want to do alot more reading and research befor taking the plunge into metals.
If the concept that brand recognition, quality of finish and limited mintages are reasons behind price differances in silver pricing needs expalining then I would be sticking to doing more research befor laying down your fiat on an investment that you don't understand yet. IMHO
Click to expand...


Kindly have another read through the thread. I am the OP. I wrote the above. I wrote about difficulties in purchase, even getting a response from the dealers you contact, finding if they ship or not, finding them on google, and the differences between each store and the ID requirements, there are discrepancies. My issue is with the ecommerce and basic customer service (lack off) side of things. I also try and work with companies that put real effort into their websites, so as to be able to find the information I want at a time and location suitable to me. Many dont fit this requirement.

There is another person on here who is having difficulties with fakes etc. Steve19800. This is not me.

Austacker said:
With the risk of derailing the thread, but comments like "I will take my chances" and I know others do it. Regarding SMSF's is the reason shit like this gets taken away from us. If every man and his dog works on ways of not doing the right thing, and being compliant or trying to hide things. I mean why else would it matter if you don't plan on cheating the system or have something to hide. The whole point of a SMSF is that it is completely transparent. All this does is make the ATO job real easy for them in arguing to take it away.

As it is becoming more mainstream, audits and actions will increase and people acting like this is the exact reason the ATO want to clamp down on SMSF's. Doesn't matter what aspect of life there is always someone who thinks they are different.

Secondly not real smart highlighting you plan to go against what is acceptable for SMSF and transactions and recording. I know I don't give receipts for my sales ? Which MUST accompany all transactions, in the name of the Super fund FWIW.
Click to expand...

The ATO rules are poorly written. In the past I have found the ATO very good to deal with especially when I am not doing anything wrong. The coins rule is set up to target collectibles pure and simple. I dont know anybody who buys "collectibles" by the kilo. The ATO do not want people buying collectible things that have a niche and subjective market at best for, nor do they want you drawing personal benefit from your super money too early, eg buying artwork for your house. Im doing neither. Im buying them for their silver content and their size. I consider this transaction a bullion transaction (1 kilo, 80% pure) and will defend that. Its my business. Im not ruining it for everyone, really? Im buying a kilo and if I sell it will be by the kilo. My "take a chance" comment was not in trying to hide from them, but having them see this transaction as I genuinely see it.

There has been a few discussions on this forum about the exact above scenario, people have talked about writing to the ATO for a ruling, no one posts back the outcome. Others just say things like "what coins, these are round bullion products". That tells me there are many people doing the same, just not discussing it.
 
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