Diamond & Gem investment

N

Nukz

New Member
Hey Guys,

I've talked about this on here before and noticed others have as well. Is anybody here interested in diamond investment the price rise in diamonds has been similar to that of gold in recent years. I've read abit about argyle pink diamonds in AHA magazine.

I guess my interest is purely the portability of diamonds and the market. Does anybody know though where diamonds/gem's can be purchased at least in Melbourne.

Heres a few interesting articles and youtube clips:

http://www.theage.com.au/business/diamonds-tipped-to-shine-in-2012-20120104-1pkp8.html

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KrlG09eEz4[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McMkpfZRUq8[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox1zo6Wo1v4[/youtube]
 
Diamonds are one of the worst investments you can make, unless you're a millionare who can buy the best of the best.

Sorry I don't have any hard facts, neither can I add anything to this discussion but that's my opinion on them.
 
I know of a couple in Melbourne CBD
None of them will talk to you if your not in the trade
I have a friend who just spent $7k on a 1.57c diamond & it cracked ,no come back
Argyles are a scam ,nobody values them except Argyle them selfs
Unless you have a degree in diamond technology
DONT get into diamonds
 
spannermonkey said:
(snip) None of them will talk to you if your not in the trade (snip)
Unless you have a degree in diamond technology
DONT get into diamonds
Click to expand...

Agreed. Mate, unless you have a jewish friend who's a diamond dealer, then prepare to lose a lot of money. Gemstones is a real specialist area and you need thorough training.

Have you heard of the famous "rainbow collection"?

3854_rainbow.jpg


There was a documentary about this guy, a jewish diamond dealer in Antwerp, and in the "old days" (30+ years ago), only clear diamonds were valued; coloured one were seen as "worthless". They actually used to grind up the coloured ones and this rainbow coloured diamond dust was used to line the boxes that held the clear diamonds. Eddy Elzas loved the coloured diamond dust and asked the miners if they could please start supplying him with whole coloured diamonds for his own personal collection. Eventually as many years passed, coloured diamonds became very valuable. Eddy collected them when they were regarded as worthless.
 
Black_Sun said:
spannermonkey said:
(snip) None of them will talk to you if your not in the trade (snip)
Unless you have a degree in diamond technology
DONT get into diamonds
Click to expand...

Agreed. Mate, unless you have a jewish friend who's a diamond dealer, then prepare to lose a lot of money. Gemstones is a real specialist area and you need thorough training.

Have you heard of the famous "rainbow collection"?

http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/3854_rainbow.jpg

There was a documentary about this guy, a jewish diamond dealer in Antwerp, and in the "old days" (30+ years ago), only clear diamonds were valued; coloured one were seen as "worthless". They actually used to grind up the coloured ones and this rainbow coloured diamond dust was used to line the boxes that held the clear diamonds. Eddy Elzas loved the coloured diamond dust and asked the miners if they could please start supplying him with whole coloured diamonds for his own personal collection. Eventually as many years passed, coloured diamonds became very valuable. Eddy collected them when they were regarded as worthless.
Click to expand...

I am Jewish ,& I know the Kosher jewellers in town,
NOTHING for me
NO love
The best I can do is get the jeweller I use & used to train in the gym with 25 years ago
Is get him to look on the web site & give me prices
All prices are GST included NO discount for cash
Cheapiest ,lowest grade rock




Around $10k :rolleyes:

:lol:

Yeah sure I'll go & park $10k in a rock
I'd rather spend the money on a vintage car like a Porsche 356 & restore it .
Much better return than a rock & much more fun to enjoy when its finished :)
 
Now restoring vintage cars - there's some good money there if you know what you're doing!

malachii
 
spannermonkey said:
I am Jewish ,& I know the Kosher jewellers in town,
NOTHING for me
NO love
The best I can do is get the jeweller I use & used to train in the gym with 25 years ago
Is get him to look on the web site & give me prices
All prices are GST included NO discount for cash
Cheapiest ,lowest grade rock
Click to expand...

Crikey. Thanks for that info. I knew that the diamond industry was pretty much "a closed shop"; viz. a family business. But if you had asked me, then my guess would have been that someone like yourself would be in with a good chance, much much better than most. Obviously not. The shop really is shut tight.

Gemstones has always interested me. When younger (<14 years), I had a dream of travelling the world buying & selling. That never happened. Its quite a dangerous business, very lucrative, exotic travel and bizarre ways of bargaining in some places.
 
Black_Sun said:
Eventually as many years passed, coloured diamonds became very valuable. Eddy collected them when they were regarded as worthless.
Click to expand...

I'm doing that with Quartz - it'll be worth something one day trust me!

:lol:
 
Even if the diamond industry wasn't a closed shop, the bid ask spread is huge. The bid ask spread on bullion coins is much lower. For example the ask premium on ASEs is $3.00 or less. The bid premium from the dealer on that ASE is $1.80. So you are out about $1.00 or less than 5%. I don't know the exact spread on diamonds, but it is much, much higher and the market is much less liquid.
 
There was just another thread on this I think in the ecinomics section. Terrible investment espescially ones with patented names. I have alot of experience with this but i dont want to go over it again. just listen to what people here are saying and save yourself from a bad mistake.
 
Wow thanks guys for the info, seems like i asked the right people for sure. I can definitely say we have a consensus on this issue :-)

By the sound of things the industry is very small and buying and selling maybe limited to the people i purchased from which is very worrying.

Theres been so much talk about Argyle pink diamonds as late i just had to ask but its very interesting to find out that the only people who can value them are the Argyle diamond people themselves which is concerning to say the least.

Thanks again guys, thats why i love this forum :-)
 
Hi,
I am not sure how true it is but I heard that they only release a certain amount of diamonds per year to keep the price high and stockpile the rest, could be complete rubbish but was enough to put me off.

Blake.
 
Blake17 said:
Hi,
I am not sure how true it is but I heard that they only release a certain amount of diamonds per year to keep the price high and stockpile the rest, could be complete rubbish but was enough to put me off.

Blake.
Click to expand...
True
 
Glen beck had a handful of diamonds on his GBTV episode about a month or so ago. Didnt really say much about them, just showed them in his hand and continued on with the show.
 
Hi, i have a really decent gemstone collection and i think the above posts seem to be strictly talking about high-end gems.

I recommend getting into cheaper gems such as topaz, quartz, garnet etc and then working your way up the ladder, also get some lab diamonds and CZ's so to familarise yourself (know your enemy).

Get some Rough and Cabochon (opaque- not transparent or translucent) ( some low level gems with inclusions that look amazing but dont cost a fortune. Learn about cuts, grades, clarity, colour lustre etc.

Buy yourself a jewellers loupe. Take some books out at the library.

Like anything... do it in increments. If you rush into gemstone purchases the chances of you getting ripped off are massive.

My advice is get gemstones SI1 & Si2 (slight inclusions) and worse that cost less but are obviously real.. i particularly rate emeralds with blue inclusions and aquamarine with multi-colours.. i also love sphene and other lesser know gemstones which are still affordable.

I would definitley advise againest diamonds and especially perfect clarity colourless gemstones (which most here seem to be talking about).. as they look and feel like $2 cubic zirconia.. Im sure lots of gemstones are great investments.. just not the massively manipuluatied semi-precious diamond market.

I find them hard to take images of which makes selling tricky but i love how small they are.. my entire collection fits into a biscuit tin...

1. buy a jewellers loupe
2. get some cheaper included gemstones
3. buy a variety of gems to find out which you rate.
4. find out where the gems are mined and what the future supply looks like.
5. Study and learn the craft
6. Incrementally build you collection along with your knowledge

Feel free to PM me for sources of cheaper gemstones and also other gemstone secrets.

PS: Opals are in a massive bearish market.. i dont see any demand for these internationally so stay clear. Investment is about getting a supply for a product of which there will be massive future demand so youll need to predict future market sentiment. IE: During the japanese financail bubble up until 91 Opals were HUGE

As with all investments.. a fool and his money are easily parted.

1for1
 
In addition to 1for1's advice, if you like rocks & minerals in general, then find a night-class in gemmology (a non-professional course) and do it. Its so much fun, and you learn how to easily identify gemstones within a few weeks. Our instructor (did this years ago) brought in about 10 unnamed gemstones, each different, and by using special gemmology equipment, we identified them, about 85% correct. Its incredibly satisfying and educational.
 
1for1 said:
Opals are in a massive bearish market.. i dont see any demand for these internationally so stay clear ...
Click to expand...

Interesting to hear this. When did the sentiment turn? And what caused the change in sentiment?

Please advise. Thanks.
 
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