Why is Silver so cheap?

mmissinglink said:
Objects do not have intrinsic value though they do have intrinsic qualities. The value of a gram of diamonds or gold is dependent on humans making valuation judgements on the the object's intrinsic qualities. That judgement represents an extrinsic value, not an intrinsic value.

Only living, sentient individuals have intrinsic value. ...

....The reason why I think that it's important to not fall into the trap of claiming that some objects have intrinsic value is because unscrupulous people will take advantage of that convention and make all sorts of spurious claims....
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I am far from an idealogical philosophist, but I disagree.
A single judgment of value of an object may represent an extrinsic value to someone.
However, bordsilver summed it up beautifully:
....the market's summation of all individuals valuations.
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^^ this represents intrinsic value.
Not your individual opinion of value, but what the market will pay.
Currently for metals, this is spot price.
I like convention. :)

As far as unscrupulous people taking advantage of convention and making spurious claims.... that will happen in all walks of life - not just intrinsic value. Just make sure your not one of the gullible. :)
 
I like convention too, but I like to use the following:
Value = your individual subjective valuation of the utility derived from XXX (many times an a priori valuation).
Price = the market's summation of all individuals valuations. An objective measure that equates supply and demand at the marginal valuations of the last individuals trading. It is a real observation of events. (Note that a "market" can be two individuals haggling or it can be 1,000 people simultaneously bidding to set a benchmark price or many other permutations.)

Ignoring time/search costs then assuming you own XXX, then if price > value you're willing to sell. If price < value, you're willing to buy.
 
wrcmad said:
mmissinglink said:
Objects do not have intrinsic value though they do have intrinsic qualities. The value of a gram of diamonds or gold is dependent on humans making valuation judgements on the the object's intrinsic qualities. That judgement represents an extrinsic value, not an intrinsic value.

Only living, sentient individuals have intrinsic value. ...

....The reason why I think that it's important to not fall into the trap of claiming that some objects have intrinsic value is because unscrupulous people will take advantage of that convention and make all sorts of spurious claims....
Click to expand...

I am far from an idealogical philosophist, but I disagree.
A single judgment of value of an object may represent an extrinsic value to someone.
However, bordsilver summed it up beautifully:
....the market's summation of all individuals valuations.
Click to expand...
^^ this represents intrinsic value.
Not your individual opinion of value, but what the market will pay.
Currently for metals, this is spot price.
I like convention. :)

As far as unscrupulous people taking advantage of convention and making spurious claims.... that will happen in all walks of life - not just intrinsic value. Just make sure your not one of the gullible. :)
Click to expand...




Price is still a valuation at the core....it happens to be a consensus valuation (summation of all individuals valuations). Even "paper manipulation" is a type of valuation that is influencing the spot price. Therefore, price (spot) can not be an intrinsic value, it is a consensus (extrinsic) valuation. The premiums that some people pay is the added value (again, more extrinsic value).

Bottom line of all this is that a kilo of silver and a kilo of gold have no more intrinsic value than a bag of dry fallen leaves...which is zero. The value each has is determined by extrinsic valuation. To the guy who is stranded on an island with only 1 match remaining, the bag of dry leaves is much more valuable than the silver or gold. Gold and silver not only has zero intrinsic value but for thousands of years before some humans began to place a high value on it, it had zero extrinsic value as well. We happen to be living in a time when many humans place a high extrinsic value on silver and gold....that could change in time (some time in the not-too-near future) and it's possible that silver will have little value to most humans.

Therefore, gold/silver "Intrinsic value" = (empty set) (though intrinsic properties still in tact). "Extrinsic value" = (wave function or modulation) determined by current human desire. "Price" = consensus extrinsic valuation.



.
 
mmissinglink said:
....To the guy who is stranded on an island with only 1 match remaining, the bag of dry leaves is much more valuable than the silver or gold....
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I repeat, a single judgment of value of an object may represent an extrinsic value to someone, but does not constitute intrinsic value.
We may have to agree to disagree?
You can repeat philosophical analogies for as long as you like, it doesn't make it any more correct to me.

As I said before, convention works for me:

intrinsic value Definitions:
Economics: No intrinsic value exists for any good or service except its price (see use value) which is reflection of its demand and supply position and not of any inherent quality.

Read more: http://www.businessdictionary.com/definition/intrinsic-value.html#ixzz2Z7MWwcWv
 
Naphthalene Man said:
pro$pector said:
More important than the question of why is silver so cheap, would be the question of is that you in your avatar photo? :lol:
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Another question to ask is why does a 39y/o have a twenty something girl as their avatar?
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Because I like chics...I'm not gay...and because I can.
 
Yep, looks like here we go again. :rolleyes:
Who knows? Perhaps this is just the usual Friday dip and it will continue upwards next week.
This past week has given me a bit more hope that a bottom has been reached and a subsequent recovery has started.
The trouble & strife part of the year for the US is rapidly approaching with the debt ceiling issue and so forth so that will undoubtedly throw everything back up in the air also.
It's just impossible to predict the short term outlook on anything in this crazy economic environment.
 
TreasureHunter said:
Sub 20 $ price again. We'll see if it's part of the sideways trading or if we are going to experience a further dip.
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It will be sideways trading for 5-10 years at least
 
It will be sideways trading for 5-10 years at least
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If that is the case, perfectly fine. I have an 15-18 year outlook ( = years to retirement) and there are at least 2 more 'bubbles' to endure (stocks, bonds, property, commodities, gold, silver, Pt group, take your pick)
I have exposure to all but vary the amount of each. No one should be 100% precious metals!
Recent activity since March is selling shares and adding to gold and silver on dips.

I missed the boat on Pd in 2009.

The Palladium overall trend is...up since 1958. Hallmarked since 2010. Stockpile size unknown.
If you bought the dips every 10 years and sold out 3 years later you'd be laughing.

Palladium_prices.png
 
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