Why is gold rising so steeply?

TreasureHunter said:
If it's going to be that bad, then why not buy canned food, water, biscuits...?
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I'm presuming he already has a 'bug out plan' which includes an ability to live of the grid for awhile (water, food, energy ...). If you truly held the belief that Mrsilverservice said then you would wouldn't you?

I agree things have the potential to get bad, but I also think in this country things shouldn't get too bad. Never hurts to take some protections though. It's how far you go that I've always wondered?
 
Gonzo said:
I'm presuming he already has a 'bug out plan' which includes an ability to live of the grid for awhile (water, food, energy ...). If you truly held the belief that Mrsilverservice said then you would wouldn't you?

I agree things have the potential to get bad, but I also think in this country things shouldn't get too bad. Never hurts to take some protections though. It's how far you go that I've always wondered?
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"Bug out" usually works for a while only. It's great having your own garden to grow your own food etc. That's more precious than gold or fiat money or crypto...
 
Yeah weve been bugged out for years now you could say haha. We have a big garden and some chickens right now but really only the 2 legged animals are wild and dangerous. Everything else is food!
We are in the Rockies so animals of those varieties.
 
"Why is gold rising so steeply?". & "Two days ago I asked myself: where's the correction?"

I just cannot believe you people do not understand that the reason for the rise in the fabricated price of FIAT is because of the massive invention of make-believe 'MONEY'. i.e. Why is gold rising so steeply? is the question = just invent MONEY out of thin air at the rate of 100 times & you will get an increase of 100 times (measured in fiat)(barring MaNiPuLaTiOn) SIMPLE ENOUGH FOR A 4th grader. _JOHNLGALT.
p.s. I hope the colours, font size, bold & CAPITOLS did not trigger the LEFTIES. LOLOL.
 
JOHNLGALT said:
"Why is gold rising so steeply?". & "Two days ago I asked myself: where's the correction?"

I just cannot believe you people do not understand that the reason for the rise in the fabricated price of FIAT is because of the massive invention of make-believe 'MONEY'. i.e. Why is gold rising so steeply? is the question = just invent MONEY out of thin air at the rate of 100 times & you will get an increase of 100 times (measured in fiat)(barring MaNiPuLaTiOn) SIMPLE ENOUGH FOR A 4th grader. _JOHNLGALT.
p.s. I hope the colours, font size, bold & CAPITOLS did not trigger the LEFTIES. LOLOL.
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Message to me (just for my ego). = GOOD ONE JOHN, one of your best.
 
JOHNLGALT said:
"Why is gold rising so steeply?". & "Two days ago I asked myself: where's the correction?"

I just cannot believe you people do not understand that the reason for the rise in the fabricated price of FIAT is because of the massive invention of make-believe 'MONEY'. i.e. Why is gold rising so steeply? is the question = just invent MONEY out of thin air at the rate of 100 times & you will get an increase of 100 times (measured in fiat)(barring MaNiPuLaTiOn) SIMPLE ENOUGH FOR A 4th grader. _JOHNLGALT.
p.s. I hope the colours, font size, bold & CAPITOLS did not trigger the LEFTIES. LOLOL.
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You didn't get the depth of my question.

Note these:
- money-printing without backing has been with us for many decades
- Japan has been "easing" since the early 2000's in order to fight deflation
- the Fed has introduced QE1 in 2008, then came QE2, QE3 etc.
- Gold has been rising since the early 2000's, then it took a "rest" with a dip approx. 6 years ago (gold crash, which I did in fact predict here on the forum), so gold kept going down for years

Why is gold rising now?
Why EXACTLY now, since summer 2019? What ignited it now?
The keyword here is "now". Why now?

It could have shot up in 2014, 2015, 2016... why now?

What happened this summer?

Katherine Lagarde sudeenly decided to stock up? The Fed is buying secretly? The rich just panicked and have a hunger for gold?

What exactly is happening right now?

...because:
- they were printing money for ages... there's nothing new about it: fiat is toilet paper and we knew that 10 years ago
- warmongering? it's been there for ages (true: now it's a lot worse, but even warmongering has been with us in 2014, 2015, 2016...)
- China, Russia buying? yes, they have been for years...

What exactly is happening now that gold has embarked prolly for the next bull market. This is the big question. So, let's analyze.

What I think makes this powerful decisive uproar very special...

1) Saudis want to sell oil to China in Yuan:
https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Saudi-Arabia-Threatens-To-Drop-Dollar-For-Oil-Trades.html

<<< this is a heavy event (yet, so many disregard it): from what I've heard, they're already selling oil to China in exchange for yuans

2) Russia and China are massively getting rid of US dollars (bonds, treasuries...) and they're teaming up, Russians explicitly state that they're
getting rid of their dollar assets

3) Russia makes bilateral agreement with Turkey in order to ditch the dollar in bilateral trade (fresh news: October 8th, 2019):
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2019-10/08/c_138456608.htm

4) Iran and Russia made a similar agreement in September (they ditched the dollar in bilateral trade):
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2019-09/26/c_138422681.htm

5) Trump slams China with trade war - could this have "made" the Chinese sell more dollars and buy more gold?


Anything else anyone would like to add?

I think the Saudi step to sell oil in yuan is a huge, thick, sharp nail in the US dollar's coffin.

I'm not happy at all about all this turmoil in the world. It's getting VERY ugly.
 
TreasureHunter said:
Anything else anyone would like to add?
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Nice summary.

It's interesting that discussion of the oft promoted "reset" (see Rickards for instance) seems to have dropped out of favour.

Now IF there is any basis to the reset concept, then the use of gold as a new reserve currency base would inspire demand by those in the know - which seems to be happening. However, surely those in the know would realise that leverage of over 500 to one in the Comex makes that price discovery irrelevant, other than a way to maintain an artificially low gold price. Cue conspiracy chords for Chinese intervention to assist physical gold transfer.

So the big question for me is how much longer can the artificially low Comex price be used to funnel gold from West to East in anticipation of a reset.

(and yes, I believe the reset is on the cards, and yes, the world is getting uglier by the day.)
 
JulieW said:
Nice summary.

It's interesting that discussion of the oft promoted "reset" (see Rickards for instance) seems to have dropped out of favour.

Now IF there is any basis to the reset concept, then the use of gold as a new reserve currency base would inspire demand by those in the know - which seems to be happening. However, surely those in the know would realise that leverage of over 500 to one in the Comex makes that price discovery irrelevant, other than a way to maintain an artificially low gold price. Cue conspiracy chords for Chinese intervention to assist physical gold transfer.

So the big question for me is how much longer can the artificially low Comex price be used to funnel gold from West to East in anticipation of a reset.

(and yes, I believe the reset is on the cards, and yes, the world is getting uglier by the day.)
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China is often brought up as the "savior" to end the gold/silver rigging in the Comex, and to replace the dollar eventually as the world reserve currency, etc. Everyone assumes China is so wealthy and honest (not corrupt), unlike the dastardly US and everyone else.

Remember a few years ago how the Shanghai Gold Exchange was being celebrated by the online PM pumper pundits as going to remove all the physical gold from the planet because again, it was from China and they were going to save the world from its sins? How has that gone? Has the manipulation ended?

Well, look at what happened to the wonderful Shanghai Gold Exchange recently...

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rel...e-chinese-physical-gold-market-300915720.html

Anyone hoping China will save the world will be about at satisfied as their citizens in "re-education" camps right now, or prison getting ready to "donate" their organs. I guess when they do take over the world they will have a better array of organ donors (DNA varieties) to take from?
 
criminals who had stolen trillions would want they money continue to buy things, the games continue
re-set would make those fun useless, just like soviet money were dumped near a lake back in the 90s

1/ checked the Saudi book, how did Yuan appeared in their balance sheet ???
2/ dollar weaponized, so there is no other way for Russia and China to continue playing the game but to gold
3/ Nato member avoiding dollar, Turkey after a few other counties joining the alternative payments system
5/ there is not much use in dollars left, reserves been going down from 65% all the way to the breaking point ?

there is no transparency in dollar system, you do not know how much there are actually exist, like barrier before the Eurodollar, dollar outside the US
the dollar black hole was created with he shell oil domestically, but the US is consuming more oil than they actually produced and imported from Canada and Mexico

Saudi would buy S-400, just to protect their oil facility; remember those drones, they can be used against US personnel stealing Syrian oil
the countries under US influence are burning, like Barcelona n Chile etc they are not in the news
 
@JulieW

I think the collapse (if it happens), will not affect all countries. The differences are enormous from country to country, from region to region.

Just compare the following countries (politically, economically, geographically, socially... etc.):
Cuba - Germany - China - Bolivia - Vietnam - Hungary - Australia - French Polynesia - Norway - India - Russia - Singapore - Brazil - Albania - Iran - Switzerland...

Some will survive, despite heavy interconnection of economies.
Others might not even feel the "collapse" - I have a few guesses: Mongolia, Bhutan, Ethiopia, Burkina Faso, the Vatican :)

Probably, the more isolated, the better. (I started thinking whether New Zealand would enter that category, it's prosperous, though).

The 2007-2008 crisis was barely felt in Poland. They were the only EU country that remained "outside" the recession:

"Since 1990 Poland has pursued a policy of economic liberalization and its economy was the only one in the EU to avoid a recession through the 2007-2008 economic downturn.[25] As of 2019 the Polish economy has been growing steadily for the past 28 years, a record high in the EU and only surpassed by Australia in the world economy.[26]"
(source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Poland)

Poland had formidable economic growth, while the rest of Europe slumped and Greece almost drowned, while Hungary almost went down "the Greek road" (the previous socialist, former communist government has "taken care" of the economy):
https://www.brookings.edu/blog/futu...polands-state-bank-helped-it-avoid-recession/

No, the entire world won't collapse. I don't believe that. Some will benefit (on the backs of others).

Pick a country (but it will be very hard), move there if you want to avoid a massive Venezuelan-type collapse. But due to the nature of the problem, I think even Switzerland, Japan or Canada won't be safe.

At least in Canada you'd have plenty of space & places for "bugging out". If you like eating fish and if you enjoy the company of bears.
 
Jim4silver said:
China is often brought up as the "savior" to end the gold/silver rigging in the Comex, and to replace the dollar eventually as the world reserve currency, etc. Everyone assumes China is so wealthy and honest (not corrupt), unlike the dastardly US and everyone else.
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The US government is corrupted, but the rest of the world is no better. The US (and Australia) has advantages that China don't have and can never achieve. Large farmlands, great fresh water rivers and lakes, and resources separated from Euroasia by great oceans, a relatively smaller population, self-sufficiency in food and energy and a legal system.

Much has been talked about China's 4 trillion dollar reserves, but divided by the Chinese population only amounts to $2500 a person. In comparison, Singapore has a $700 billion dollar reserves, which divided by 3.5 million citizens works out to $200k a person, 80 times of China. Singapore has lots of problems, but compared to China, Singapore's problems can be easily overcome due to having a much smaller population.

Anyone who is looking for China to save the world, save Europe will be disappointed because it won't happen. I see no way out of this mess other than a reset.

India is also facing the same issue as China. Too many mouths to feed and lots of jobs need to be created to prevent social unrest. The overpopulation and limited resources is a situation that has no solution. This is why there is massive migration out of China and India.
 
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sgbuyer said:
The US government is corrupted, but the rest of the world is no better. The US (and Australia) has advantages that China don't have and can never achieve. Large farmlands, great fresh water rivers and lakes, and resources separated from Euroasia by great oceans, a relatively smaller population, self-sufficiency in food and energy and a legal system.

Much has been talked about China's 4 trillion dollar reserves, but divided by the Chinese population only amounts to $2500 a person. In comparison, Singapore has a $700 billion dollar reserves, which divided by 3.5 million citizens works out to $200k a person, 80 times of China. Singapore has lots of problems, but compared to China, Singapore's problems can be easily overcome due to having a much smaller population.

Anyone who is looking for China to save the world, save Europe will be disappointed because it won't happen. I see no way out of this mess other than a reset.

India is also facing the same issue as China. Too many mouths to feed and lots of jobs need to be created to prevent social unrest. The overpopulation and limited resources is a situation that has no solution. This is why there is massive migration out of China and India.
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Singapore:
- they'd be better off stacking gold (just like China does); they have a bunch of private vaults as far as I know
- a food crisis could obliterate them: you can barely buy a fresh salad in the country (trust me, I've been there several times and have eaten around: almost no fresh fruits or vegetables or... they have galactic prices)
- they're on an island and considering the size and lack of resources, they could easily wake up in an "Escape from Singapore" scenario (if you know the movies "Escape from LA" or "Escape from New York", you know what I mean)
- Singapore depends a lot on speculative activities (finance etc.), a bit like HK - so, if that falls, the dominos fall

The ones who will survive:
- countries that have rich natural reserves vital for life (water and good agriculture: Hungary, Poland, France)
- countries rich in vital energy resources (oil, gas etc.: Norway, Russia for instance)
- countries that are peaceful and stable (Estonia, Hungary, Portugal... I wanted to include Chile, but with the recent riots the didn't make it into the list!)
- countries with a decent military, despite their size, countries that aren't anywhere near conflict zones (Switzerland)
- countries with a healthy traditional way of life (it's odd how "healthy traditional" has become a taboo nowadats... hmmm... make your guess!)
- countries that are decently and adequately industrialized, but not overindustrialized (Germany, Austria, Japan, South Korea) - others who barely produce any "real value" will most likely suffer a lot (Singapore, Cyprus, Greece, Croatia, Colombia, Argentina)

Forget the "postindustrial prosperity". Create real value that remains and you will survive: agriculture + industry
 
TreasureHunter said:
Singapore:
- they'd be better off stacking gold (just like China does)
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On a per person basis, Singapore has many times more gold than China although it could be improved because people are holding too much cash. Per person cash is easily 6 figures average. It's crazy to hold $100k+ in the bank doing nothing.

TreasureHunter said:
Forget the "postindustrial prosperity". Create real value that remains and you will survive: agriculture + industry
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Actually, you're right on the fresh food, fresh food here is expensive as compared to Australia and the US, but when population is small, the solution is easy. Just buy a couple thousand acres of land in Malaysia, Indonesia or Australia and grow your own foods and rear your own chickens. There are lots of problems in Singapore, but all insignificant as compared to what is happening in China and HK.

TreasureHunter said:
others who barely produce any "real value" will most likely suffer a lot (Singapore, Cyprus, Greece, Croatia, Colombia, Argentina)
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As for financial crisis, it's not the first time. I was already working in 1998, Singapore was hardly affected. We had economic crisises non-stop after that, in 2001, then SARS 2004, then 2008. SARS was the only economic crisis which you can actually see a crisis in Singapore, because people were so scared they stayed at home.
 
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sgbuyer said:
Actually, you're right on the fresh food, fresh food here is expensive as compared to Australia and the US, but when population is small, the solution is easy. Just buy a couple thousand acres of land in Malaysia, Indonesia or Australia and grow your own foods and rear your own chickens. There are lots of problems in Singapore, but all insignificant as compared to what is happening in China and HK.

As for financial crisis, it's not the first time. I was already working in 1998, Singapore was hardly affected. We had economic crisises non-stop after that, in 2001, then SARS 2004, then 2008. SARS was the only economic crisis which you can actually see a crisis in Singapore, because people were so scared they stayed at home.
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You are right, but Singapore must have very good relations with Malaysia and Indonesia in order to be able to buy and use agricultural land there.
5.6 million people is a lot if you consider the size of the country (and density). There are very few grassy/forest areas. And they're not being massively used for agriculture.

The population went up by approx. 1,6 million since the year 2000. That's a lot.

Singaporeans are very friendly and intelligent people. I loved my visits to Singapore. I also hope it will remain prosperous and safe. Away from major conflicts/tensions. And, I guess pretty much everyone around has reasons and interests to love and protect Singapore.

In fact, I think it's one of the best places currently in the world ;)
 
TreasureHunter said:
In fact, I think it's one of the best places currently in the world ;)
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I wouldn't say Singapore is one of the best place currently. There are many risks as what you have mentioned.

The only reason I brought up Singapore is because China had been trying to model after the Singapore economic model but it's impossible because of population difference. Furthermore, the defects of the state dominated capitalist model has started to show up in Singapore in recent years. Whatever problems you will see in Singapore will appear in China in the future if China follows this path. Because of small population and open economy, Singapore can get away with policy mistakes that will cause disaster in other countries.

As for the next Asian financial crisis, the Singapore government has been preparing for it since 2011 when the first property cooling measure was imposed. It’s crazy, the market only just recovered from 2008-2009 recession and they slammed it down. Since 2011 there had been 7 cumulative cooling measures. Property bubble bursts are so common in Singapore, a 30-40% drop is now a non event. In fact the public housing market in Singapore which is three quarters of the total market just crashed 30% in just over a year and it’s hardly even talked about on social media.
 
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