US May Further Debase Coinage

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Congressman looking to make all US coinage from steel, may affect silver supply, price and volatility;

A measure introduced in the U.S. Congress seeks to replace the base metal of most American coins with steel. The move would slash zinc, nickel and copper content of U.S. coins to a fraction of today's already reduced levels. Like past changes in metal content, the bill represents a logical continuation of currency debasement and calls into question the strength of U.S. fiat currencyyet another sign of the decline of the global monetary system.

Congressman Steve Stivers (R-OH) introduced the bill, H.B. 1719the "Cents and Sensibility Act"on April 24. It mandates that pennies, nickels, dimes and quarters be composed primarily of steel; specifically U.S. produced steel. He presents the bill as a budget measure, stating, "This legislation is a common-sense solution to decrease the cost of minting our coins. Not only will it cost less, but steel is an American resource that we have here at home and can be manufactured right here in our backyard." His office asserts that, according to the House Financial Services Committee, the U.S. government would save up to $433 million over 10 years.

Conveniently, Worthington Industries, a steel processor that supplies steel blanks for Canadian currency, is located in Stivers' district and strongly supports the bill.

At present, a penny contains 97.5% zinc and 2.5% copper (for exterior plating) while a nickel contains 75% copper and 25% nickel. Yes, a nickel contains more copper than a penny! Dimes and quarters contain a different cupronickel blend of 8.33% nickel to 91.67% copper. As of May 8, a penny contains one-half cent worth of metal; nickels contain 4.7 cents. Factoring in production costs, the U.S. Mint reported that a penny cost 2 and a nickel cost 10 to manufacture in 2012. Interestingly enough, an external consultant to the Mint found that steel pennies would cost the same as the zinc-copper blend. A steel coin mandate would all but eliminate copper, nickel and zinc from the currency and significantly reduce the value of nickels, dimes and quarters, as iron is far more common.

Though not considered precious metals per se, zinc, nickel and copper are often mined from locations also rich in silver.

Indeed, the vast majoritysomewhere in the range of 70%of silver mining occurs as a by-product of other metal extraction. Thus the amount of silver mined depends on the demand for these other metals. In 2012, the U.S. Mint consumed 14,662 metric tons of zinc for new penny minting and 6,244.8 metric tons of nickel to produce nickels, dimes and quarters. Another 36,031 metric tons of copper went into nickels, dimes and quarters. Taking this much out of demand for zinc, nickel and copper will reduce new supplies of silver, introducing more volatility and price increases into the silver market.

Besides threatening the world's supply of silver, Stivers' bill draws attention to the lack of real value in U.S. currency. Gold coins as circulating currency ceased in 1933. Silver was largely eliminated from coins by 1965. Copper was dropped from pennies in 1982. Each change precipitated a rush to hoard the discontinued coins, which in turn triggered the government to flood the market with the new issuesoffering a near perfect examples of Gresham's Law: "Bad money drives out good." Expect a repeat of this phenomenon if Stivers' bill becomes law.

To students of economic history, these currency debasements sound both familiar and disturbing. As Mike Maloney explains in Guide to Investing in Gold and Silver, great civilizations have resorted to debasement to squeeze more profit from their citizens. Pocketing the difference between face values and actual cost amounts to no less than a hidden tax, but one more nefarious than an overt tax. Fiddling with coin content creates questions about the integrity of government policies and destabilizes confidence in the currency. It makes sense: If a silver dollar isn't really silver, is it still a dollar? Why?

Sure enough, from Athens to Rome to modern times, debasement of currencies has occurred in times of stress. Each time, however, debasement unleashed destabilization and introduced inflation. Indeed, debasements of Athenian silver coinage created the first state inflation in the West. Moreover, frequent debasement is a sure sign of a weak state teetering on the edge of collapse. Economists can trace the collapse of the Western Roman Empire by tracking the rate of currency debasement. As the third U.S. currency debasement in a hundred years, Stivers' bill begs the questionis the United States economy entering a terminal collapse?

Rep. Stivers' bill may not passthis is the third year he has introduced the measure. However, since 2010, the U.S. Mint has studied alternate metals for use in coins. Steel alloys are among the top candidates. Regardless of how it comes, the reduction or elimination of zinc, nickel or copper from U.S. currency is a debasement. Following so quickly on other debasements, these initiatives concretely demonstrate the weakness of the American currency and the ongoing determination of the government to maintain the fiat currency shell game for as long as possible.
WealthCycles.com

Next logical step in continuing to take the piss I suppose :/
 
Is there anything left to debase?

Now that gold and silver have gone from the coinage does it really matter what metal the coin is made from?

They are now just tokens to use in exchange for goods, in themselves they haven't been a store of value since 1964.

They should be nice and magnetic as well, I am sure the smaller euro cent coins are copper plated steel and they are magnetic, not that you can get many of them, last time I was in Europe most of the small village shops had run out of small change.
 
Obama and Congress fiddling while America burns. As well as debasing the currency, by removing copper from coinage, the proposal is blatant protectionism of the US steel industry. If the US steel industry becomes a captive industry beholden to government contracts (coinage and GM/Government Motors) then its' no longer a part of the free market and an example of fascism in the economic sense.

And yes Willrocks I wonder if they will rust? After 5-10 years of steel coinage of ever increasing cost, will the steel alloy blend be changed become even cheaper, the side effect being prone to rusting.
 
worldbubble said:
next step US Congress decides to print dollars not on paper but on air

Bitcoins or similar is testing waters now. What will they come up with. Like you say out of air for them ?
 
Congressman Steve Stivers (R-OH) introduced the bill, H.B. 1719the "Cents and Sensibility Act"

Jane Austen started rolling in her grave long ago; but I think she would add on a couple of thousand rpms if she saw this title.

Conveniently, Worthington Industries, a steel processor that supplies steel blanks for Canadian currency, is located in Stivers' district and strongly supports the bill.

Was already expecting this when I read the title. I suspect certain recycling/scrap metal concerns would benefit from the influx of tin, nickel, copper, bronze etc. Making cash dollars from nickels & dimes (literally).

AngloSaxon said:
If the US steel industry becomes a captive industry beholden to government contracts (coinage and GM/Government Motors) then its' no longer a part of the free market and an example of fascism in the economic sense.

According to the OECD, the largest two consumers of steel remains the construction sector (50%), followed by the transport sector (16%). (Source:http://www.oecd.org/industry/ind/45145459.pdf)

Does anybody know the total mintage of all common US coins in circulation, so we can estimate their total weight?

I suspect if every US circulating coin in existance was replaced with one of same weight in stainless steel, it'd barely matter to steel demand.
 
Roswell Crash Survivor said:
AngloSaxon said:
If the US steel industry becomes a captive industry beholden to government contracts (coinage and GM/Government Motors) then its' no longer a part of the free market and an example of fascism in the economic sense.

According to the OECD, the largest two consumers of steel remains the construction sector (50%), followed by the transport sector (16%). (Source:http://www.oecd.org/industry/ind/45145459.pdf)

You may have missed my point. The proposed Act mandates the steel must have been produced in the US.

Steel for construction can come from anywhere. The amount of Chinese steel used for housing in Australia may surprise you. A friend who retails construction steel to tradies says they have to sell Chinese housing steel as customers want cheap cheap cheap and if they only stock Australian, their tradie customers will go elsewhere. Blame anyone who renovates or is building houses for that - ie the majority of society who buy on price not quality or place of manufacture.

What I was getting at is the US steel industry has been in decline for decades, and Congress mandating to itself that government used steel must only come from a domestic source, that domestic source may become reliant on their government contracts at a set price and their other customers who shop on price will use imported steel. Over time the US steel industry will become even more reliant on government and government will control the industry, which is why I said 'fascism in the economic sense'.
 
Time to invest in vending machine companies. Every vending machine in the USA would have to have it's coin rejector modified.
 
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