The unwritten rule of trading.

southerncross

southerncross

Well-Known Member
Silver Stacker
Whats with the shunning of newer members with no feedback in the trading section ? Sure there are some suspect WTS threads but the meme lately seems to be to shut them down with unneeded comments without a second thought, unless of course there is a gain to be had, as with the recent sealed 15 kg pamp box.

It sort of make's things seem a bit ugly here with the pile on's that happen and I think people forget that nobody here except GP started with any cred at all. Sure be careful and all that but I really don't see any need for some of the apparent hostility that has been taking place recently. If you don't like then just don't buy but also don't comment. I'm sure most here have the ability to suss things out for themselves without the need of self appointed sales Gestapo dumping on new members.

I have some history here but keep my info private as do a few others, But if for instance I wanted to sell some product and given the current influence from those regular traders towards those with no feedback history, I would think personally that I would be seen as suspect by new members and have been see so in the past. Not everybody want's to advertise for all to see and for some people just a single trade can blitz a lot of volume seen as total feedback.

Is there in fact an instance of a virgin member ripping anybody off ?

I totally expect people here to look out for one another but I also think people need to be given a chance and not be jumped on for not abiding by unwritten rules that they may innocently might not be aware of and be given a chance.

Just my two grams worth.

(edited for ganmar)
 
Yes SC.. I agreee with you 100%..Give the new members the benefit of the doubt especially if they are only buying or selling small amounts. Notice that you have no trades next to your name and I only have 2 and then one was for selling on behalf of my son..Only other trade was with Maggie. She didn't bat an eyelid and traded with me as if we had been doing business for years.

I guess that because I am a Stacker and not a trader, my trading numbers will remain low and if I ever have to sell, then I too might find it hard to attract buyers.

I have bought through my local silver trader direct for many years, take delivery personally and thus avoid postage charges. This works fine for me as I am only a little fish in a big pond.

Give new members the benefit of the doubt for small amount buys of silver would be a good way to start for buyers and sellers alike..

The starters pack that Maggie recently offered was an excellent way of getting a trusting business relationship going in the right direction between two parties.

Regards Errol 43
 
Agreed - members here can get a bit harsh but we have had several times where people have come on here with no feedback and only 1 post (their sale post) and listed thousands of $$ worth of product. It is generally accepted that we are in a pretty "security conscious" industry and therefore like people to build a bit of trust before launching into selling their stash.

If newbies are genuine - then offer to do f2f only, use a known 3rd party to hold the product until payment clears (GP has offered to do this for newbies before) or even in some cases we have seen them send the product before payment.

There have been cases (not for a while though I'll admit) where people have been burnt trading with newbies.

It always comes back to the same thing - trust. If you have none then build it through getting known in your "local" community (join in some of the non sale threads), buy some stuff first so you get trade feedback or maybe start with small, non expensive trades. Maybe even sometimes acknowledge your "newbieness" and offer some alternatives to satisfy people's natural concern (f2f, escrow, send first, other members as referees etc). After all - we can be talking serious money and quite often the exchanging of personal details (address etc). Not everyone wants some faceless internet person to know the address of their stash :O

malachii
 
^ 100% with malachii

By nature we are our own regulators and policeman. At times it seems harsh but remember that usually you do not see the successful avoidance of fraud. As above people said, there are very simple work arounds for legitimate new sellers but at the end of the day depends on one person willing to take on some risk.
 
Has anyone thought of using COD through the post office? At least they can be sort of a "middle man" for deals where anyone has suspicions on delivery or payment?
 
enzedda said:
Has anyone thought of using COD through the post office? At least they can be sort of a "middle man" for deals where anyone has suspicions on delivery or payment?
Click to expand...

COD, Escrow or F2F are the only ways I would buy something from somebody with 0 feedback.

I just consider it a trading rule for myself to reduce the chances of being scammed.

Granted having 10 feedback doesn't exactly mean the user is 100% legit but life's too short to be worried about everything and in general > 1 feedback is ok.

Having said that, I usually see some members post "hey you have 0 posts, how about u introduce yourself or some crap" in trading threads and it's hard to say if I agree with it.

On one hand they are interrupting sales threads but on the other hand if the seller goes about it nicely it is not detrimental to their thread (eg. Oh I'm new here, thanks for letting me know. I'm from BLAH and we can do F2F if you want etc). It all depends how the message is constructed though.

Personally I believe ruining a trade or two is far better than having some stacker being scammed a few grand in the grand scheme of things.
 
Here we go " Flame me " I would like to share my experience here at SilverStackers to date
We are a Precious Metals Forum, where we trade, swap, buy and sell. We share information on many subjects, hoping to put a hand out to help one and other. For over a year now we have had many new members join from Australia and overseas. I personally have dealt with many of our members ( new and and not so new ) with not even a post let alone feedback. In the time I have been here, I have never been burn't or suffered a loss where a sale is concerned. This also has another side, where many of the new members have not given their hard earned dollars to a stranger ( despite feedback ) and put their trust in that person to fulfil the deal.
I will not hesitate in offering to help a new member, how else would I be here if someone hadn't given me the benefit of the doubt and put their hand out.
Often I hear the comment that people have heard of our wonderful forum and want to join because we take care of each other and how we conduct ourselves. GP started what you all continue to make this as one of the safest and honourable forums on the net, that people want to join.
Help each other, you will feel all the better for it.
Regards Maggie

I left out about the day I may be burn't and I think to myself if this happens, the loss would be minimal in comparision to the gain I have had on a public forum in earning the trust of so many.
Thank you everyone, being a member of SilverStackers made this possible. It would be sad to see this forum become know for its unfriendliness.
 
I've not had much of an issue. Possibly because I've been buying, and funds are clear before the seller posted. I imagine selling with zero feedback would be an issue.

However, I did get a few snide remarks in a thread where I was offering to buy (cash F2F).
 
When dealing with newbies I have always offered to send 1/2 up front and the balance on receival of items - I have found it to be far less confronting for them than having someone 'expect' them to send their bars/coins without being paid first. I also go out of my way to help these guys out with postage/packing/private message info etc, so the trade goes as smoothly as possible (and so they get up to speed with trading here).

My only gripe here is the "You must introduce yourself first" faction of experienced users, who sometimes some across as rude - if its that important get this info attached in a sticky, labelled new members or something.

I think its normal for newbies to be wary when they first trade - and the key is to offer them good communication and guidance. For instance I rang a guy on gumtree the other day and he was adamant he wanted local pickup (as he didnt want to risk posting). After explaining to him about registered post etc, and the protection offered by Paypal he was willing to proceed. Long story short, invoice received and paid, money received by seller that night, goods packed and posted the next morning.
And as a result of a 10 min phonecall and a few instructive emails, theres one new seller who is no doubt feeling a whole lot more comfortable now about posting items to buyers.
 
Some of my comments directed toward new and existing members in their "buy/sell/swap" threads and elsewhere have resuled in them sending PMs to clarify and understand my viewpoint.

Some have even contained an apology. Most are now happily on their trading way.

Large scale buyers and sellers here may be able to afford to lose out on a deal and absorb the cost, but small-timers (including myself) may have to do many trades to cover any rip-off.

With several thousand members here and growing the potential for fraud can only increase. Saying "No worries, it hasnt happened yet." is no guarantee.

What would anyone here do if they were actually scammed here? How would you go about trying to get your money back? Ring the Cops? :harfriggenhar:

Better to be vigilant and proactive here than reactive IMO. If new people are fair dinkum they will get over it and get on with it.

If we are supposed to say nothing in regard to trades in threads then dont allow comments. Show the listing only and make all trading and comments be done by PM.
 
Is this a Catholic Church confessional post?

Did IQ's just suddenly drop in the last 48 hours?

The only Newbies that copped a flogging deserved it with their beligerent i'll call the shots attitude.

Get real Guys,you don't 'need' to introduce yourself to trade-but conversely you don't have to act like an Ass either.

Existing members set the standard of 'Trade etiquette & conditions'

This white washing of seagull trading methods with New members for thousands of $$ without a clue as to who they are and letting them bypass some semblance of trade safety is going to get someone burnt badly.

Lets not get all Moral about a little cautiousness now.

And SouthernCross you aint exactly a Ghost around here with no visible trades ;)
Maggie-Your to generous as always.The lady of the lake in a way.

REDBACK
 
Not all my goods, Dollars but to answer your question, I have sent orders out before payment. There is always a risk factor in the services I offer, whether it is placing an order with a company like Apmex and locking it in, ( I am under contract to pay once I do this ) If a person I am placing an order for doesn't follow through, I still must honour the order. For any person, Dealer or member there is a risk one way or another, whether it is $$$ or their name that is at risk. My name is more important to me than money.
This is not about me, but I do know SS Sponsers and members are some of the best people I have known.
 
If new members just followed some simple guides and added some details would all make life easier.

1. Take a photo of your goods with the daily paper date - This helps identify you actually have the goods
2. State your trade requirements clearly and easily - as mentioned F2F, or Platinum Post only signature required.
- Options
COD via Australia Post
Escrow
Use a SS member to pickup and pay for small commission $10 ?

I agree the biggest issue is, when people say I will not do this or will not do that etc... Instead tell what you WILL do :)

No photo's to me is the biggest mistake.
 
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