Should I start an SMSF before the government loses all my super?

T

TheEnd

Well-Known Member
I presently have 80k worth of super and have been wondering lately if I should start self managing it into precious metals before there is a major financial crash and the government lose it all.

Have been reading other threads about SMSF and its very complicating but I am determined to not lose all my savings so I will consider it seriously if i really need to.

What does everyone else think?
 
For me, I wanted my super to be a decent size before I want to bother with the costs and management of a SMSF (it needs to be worth it!). I went with ING Living Super because I could invest directly into gold shares and ETFs through their platform, though in a full blown collapse I'd expect the counter party risk would be realized and ING would not be a safe place to be.

Personally I am watching 2 things closely. Both are elections. In Australia Bill Shorten has previously referred to Australians super funds as a future wealth fund (or similar) and if he gets in I'd expect some bad super policy to be on the way and you want to be IN a SMSF before that door gets closed. The other is the US election. If Trump gets in it might trigger a crash. So if either of these risks looks likely I may move to SMSF early, but for now I am comfortable where I am....and just watching things closely.....
 
Ye i'm with Australian Super and its been appreciating about 10k per year the last few years so i'm pretty happy about what i presently have.

Cant stand the thought of losing it all.

Would really love to invest the whole lot into pm's but i think like you i think i really need to wait until both of the elections are over and done with?
 
Starting your own SMSF is not difficult, but you probably need $300K to make it worthwhile. From memory I think the basic steps are:
- Tell your accountant you want a SMSF and he will organise an off the shelf trust deed.
- Use the trust deed to set up a bank account.
- Transfer all funds from your old super fund to your new one.
- Also use the trust deed to set up any other accounts, such as Perth Mint, Guardian Vaults, Etrade, etc.
- Start trading.

There'll also be some other minor SMSF regulatory steps, but your accountant should be able to help with that.
 
300K!!!

Bloody hell i'm along way off that figure.

Why would'nt it be worth while doing with only 80K???
 
TheEnd said:
I presently have 80k worth of super and have been wondering lately if I should start self managing it into precious metals before there is a major financial crash and the government lose it all.
Have been reading other threads about SMSF and its very complicating but I am determined to not lose all my savings so I will consider it seriously if i really need to.
What does everyone else think?
Click to expand...

Its super easy to do.
www.esuperfund.com.au
They send you pre-filled forms, you sign them, and bingo a few weeks later you have a SMSF ABN, bank accoutn, metal trading account, share trading account etc.
Yearly compliance uses an easy to use online form you fill out. An hours work a year unless you do something fancy like buy property.
 
With 80K you could possibly buy a strata title parking space in the CBD if you are lucky to find a cheaper one and rent it out or you could buy a large strata title storage unit in a complex with a metal mezzanine that should make you an 8 to 9% return.
 
You can start your Super with 50k no probs at all.
Annual audit costs if investing in low transactions per annum PM's will be around $500
Accountant fees for a Super with low '# PM transactions' can be had for around $600

From the cleardocs website this below

SMSF set up + register Corporate Trustee
Set up your SMSF and the coporate trustee in one step.
$738.00
($275.00 Cleardocs fee inc. GST and $463.00 ASIC fee)

Setting up your own SMSF is not hard it just takes a bit of time and patience.
Search past threads there's a lot of good info there.

REDBACK
 
TheEnd said:
300K!!!

Bloody hell i'm along way off that figure.

Why would'nt it be worth while doing with only 80K???
Click to expand...
It sounds like it's easier now than it was a few years back.
 
O.k so the Esuperfund site was great and i like the fact that i can invest in physical PM's and they offer storage as well.

I'm thinking i would like to invest about 20k in Gold, 10k in Silver and the rest into Australian shares which has had the most appreciation in my Australian Super account over the last 5 years.

Will do some more reading and research and have a good hard think about it.
 
You can do it with any amount, heard of someone doing it with less than $10k. Just depends if you think the fees are justified to have control over your Financial Destiny and take some responsibility.

Buying PM's is good and all but you'd be much better off looking at something that provides an income or dividend. In 30 years time you'll be kicking yourself if you don't.

What makes you think your portfolio would hold better than general Super fund in a crash? If the Gov goes diddling with Super, they'll be diddling with SMSF's too.
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O.k House so what sort of investment would provide income or dividends?

I'm a bit confused now??
 
Pretty much anything except physical PM's- Property (commercial, residential), shares, bonds, ETFs, term deposits, ATM's, unit trusts managed funds etc
 
House said:
Pretty much anything except physical PM's- Property (commercial, residential), shares, bonds, ETFs, term deposits, ATM's, unit trusts managed funds etc
Click to expand...

O.k well I'm trying to keep my investment as simple as possible which is why I like physical PM's. (especially if they can be stored away for free with Esuper)

I think I need to wait and see what happens to PM prices over next few months.

Been waiting for Gold to break 1300 and beyond for the last week or so.

So many things are up in the air at the moment?
 
just leave your super alone and focus on improving your income and savings
 
There are so many things wrong in your way of thinking.

TheEnd said:
O.k well I'm trying to keep my investment as simple as possible which is why I like physical PM's. (especially if they can be stored away for free with Esuper)
Click to expand...

Gold and silver are not an investment. They're a store of wealth.

TheEnd said:
I think I need to wait and see what happens to PM prices over next few months.

Been waiting for Gold to break 1300 and beyond for the last week or so.
Click to expand...

So you're going to wait until they move higher before you buy?

TheEnd said:
So many things are up in the air at the moment?
Click to expand...

When has there ever been a time when things were not up in the air?
 
There is no set amount you need, I have mine setup with esuperfund which works out to cost about 25% of what an accountant would charge and they seem to know a heck of a lot more about the SMSF industry than most accountants.

I only have $20K-$25K in mine atm but that doesn't matter to me, I add about $7K a year to it and my running expenses are around $2K a year, leaves me about $5K to invest each year.

I figure all super money is just retirement IOU play money anyway so you may as well loose it yourself rather than paying someone else to loose it for you.

In the end I'll most likely be part of that generation that has all their super forcefully stolen through superannuation changes that will force all funds to invest only in government bonds and payouts be paid in the form of an old age pension again meaning this time super effectively just becomes another form of income tax.
 
TheEnd said:
O.k House so what sort of investment would provide income or dividends?
Click to expand...

Shares for example.
But ideally you also want ones that offer dividend reinvestment, so you just accumulate more shares automagically over time.
There are specific companies (usually the big ones) on the ASX that have dividend reinvestment schemes. These are perfect for SMSF's.
 
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