Perth Mint Buy back (remotely)?

Phiber

Phiber

Well-Known Member
Silver Stacker
Hi guys,

Quick question for those of you who have experienced buy back from the Perth Mint.
First let it be said it is not my preferred choice when it comes to selling bullion - I do hot intend to sell anyway.
But I thought it would be good to know my options as one never knows what may lie ahead.

So, I know you can bring your bullion back to the Mint and they will buy them back from you.
Now, my question is: if you live in the Eastern States, and are not able to go to the Mint without jumping on a plane, is there a way to arrange for buyback somehow?

Really keen to see if anyone has had such an experience.
Cheers
 
My understanding is the Perth Mint buyback price is pathetic so I wouldn't even go there if I was in Perth.

If you live in/near a capital city in the Eastern states you should have no trouble finding a bullion dealer or coin shop that will pay spot or close to spot.
 
If you are in the Brisbane/South East corner area, Ainslie Bullion are quite fair with their buy backs.
They do arrange for mail-in buy backs as well.
 
No problem sending your bullion over;

Intrastate/Interstate Transactions Purchase Order/Contract. If the sale has been conducted by telephone the purchase order details will be faxed or emailed to you. The Perth Mint will only conduct telephone transactions from Monday to Friday 9am until 5pm (WST) excluding Western Australian public holidays. Once a price has been agreed over the telephone, it is fixed and you will be given a purchase order number. The purchase order thus becomes a binding contract between you and The Perth Mint.
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Postage of Bullion and Insurance Arrangements. The bullion under contract must be posted to The Perth Mint on the day that the contract has been entered into. The maximum insurance cover per parcel is $15,000. In order to be covered by insurance, the parcel must be posted using Platinum Express and for security purposes it must be addressed to Mrs L Oakley, 310 Hay Street, East Perth 6004. 'The Perth Mint' must not be written in the address space, as this will invalidate the insurance cover. Any value over $15,000 will not be covered by The Perth Mint when using Platinum Express. Purchases over $15,000 will require a different method of shipment in order to be fully insured. You will need to contact The Perth Mint in this regard. Please ensure you include the completed Perth Mint transaction form with your bank details: Bank name, branch, BSB, account number and account name.
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Down near the end- http://www.perthmint.com.au/metalprices_bullion_coins_and_bars_buying_selling.aspx
 
Or you could go to W. Davis in Melbourne and get a better buy-back price than Perth Mint ... :)
 
I've seen "no buying" signs up on more than one occasion at different dealers - liquidity is not an infinite resource.

In the event of manic parabolic prices and you find that local dealers are out of cash, The Perth Mint may be the buyer of last resort in the country.
 
:D

If your price are reasonable see Chip. I might able to help of course there is a limit.
If you have a truck load , I might just buy the spare tyres only.
I guess members here can help out as well.
House might buy the truck. ;)
 
I sold my entire stack to the PM some years back. It was all PM bullion bars.

The rate wasn't great , but i drove to Perth , walked in the door and walked back out with cash in about 15 Min.

I know i could have done better, but the speed and convenience and cash on the spot was what i needed at the time.
 
goldpelican said:
I've seen "no buying" signs up on more than one occasion at different dealers - liquidity is not an infinite resource.

In the event of manic parabolic prices and you find that local dealers are out of cash, The Perth Mint may be the buyer of last resort in the country.
Click to expand...

I don't think this fact is appreciated by many and it will become a problem if we get into a bubble market and on the other side of it. You may find dealers offering to buy back but with payment delayed as they ship the metal to Perth and only pay out once we pay them.
 
bron suchecki said:
goldpelican said:
I've seen "no buying" signs up on more than one occasion at different dealers - liquidity is not an infinite resource.

In the event of manic parabolic prices and you find that local dealers are out of cash, The Perth Mint may be the buyer of last resort in the country.
Click to expand...

I don't think this fact is appreciated by many and it will become a problem if we get into a bubble market and on the other side of it. You may find dealers offering to buy back but with payment delayed as they ship the metal to Perth and only pay out once we pay them.
Click to expand...

I honestly don't think selling would be a major problem in the event of a "bubble market" in PMs. I've read enough to realize that if there is panic buying the biggest problem bullion dealers will have is getting enough inventory.

I remember 1980, when gold went from $35 a few years earlier to $850.

I remember that time there was panic buying of gold by people in the streets of New York City. They were lined up around the block to buy gold and Krugerrands at that time.
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http://www.shtfplan.com/precious-me...-they-were-lined-up-around-the-block_01132013

The skeptics among us had a frisson of self doubt when the gold price soared to a record $850 an ounce in 1980. We feared momentarily that the gold bugs were right but our panic was as fleeting as the hysteria that drove ordinary folks to line up to buy bullion from dealers like Guardian Trust, where I interviewed students, secretaries, taxi drivers and waiters on the sidewalk ready to exchange what little cash they had for a golden dream. It was the top of the market and after the bubble inevitably burst the yellow metal spent the subsequent two decades in the doldrums.
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http://www.canada.com/story_print.html?id=7dc09795-ee1f-438c-a872-316cd485cc83&sponsor=

On the other-hand if there's an industrial Silver shortage the price will remain high for many years.
 
Hi guys,

Thanks all for the input, appreciated as always.
House, thanks for the link - good stuff and exactly what I was looking for.

bron suchecki said:
goldpelican said:
I've seen "no buying" signs up on more than one occasion at different dealers - liquidity is not an infinite resource.

In the event of manic parabolic prices and you find that local dealers are out of cash, The Perth Mint may be the buyer of last resort in the country.
Click to expand...

I don't think this fact is appreciated by many and it will become a problem if we get into a bubble market and on the other side of it. You may find dealers offering to buy back but with payment delayed as they ship the metal to Perth and only pay out once we pay them.
Click to expand...

This is definitely something I keep in mind, and one of the reasons I like to know what is possible in terms of dealer but back.
Although I also understand the other argument saying parabolic prices would attract more investors.
Hard to know what would happen, but good to know the mint is always there to buy back if other options run out.
The mint would have to be the safest buyer of last resort in Australia.
I do have a couple of ABC bars and hope they would also be open for buy back but not sure how things would pan out.

Either way, good to know the mint will buy back interstate if required.
 
Yes, but as few will be selling, many buying and as buying volumes increase dealers working capital needs to increase (which they may not be able to fund). This will mean premiums will increase.

Then on the other side you have many sellers and no buyers, so buyback discounts will blow out, see http://www.chrismartenson.com/page/transcript-robert-mish "In the 1980, when we were about eight weeks backlogged and not everyone even had a refiner relationship and had to rely on other dealers who did, it got to about 30% discount for having the wrong form of silver versus the right form"

So the effective buy/sell spread on either side of that bubble could be quite large, wiping out a lot of profit.
 
willrocks said:
I honestly don't think selling would be a major problem in the event of a "bubble market" in PMs. I've read enough to realize that if there is panic buying the biggest problem bullion dealers will have is getting enough inventory.
Click to expand...

My observation in the current market is that sometimes dealers stop buying. As Bron points out - working capital requirements for dealers will increase - instead of having to have $15000-16000 cash on hand to buy a 10oz gold bar back, it might blow out to $30k. No-one can guarantee that there will be a proportionate rise in the number of buyers to even out the cash flow. Could get very lumpy.
 
bron suchecki said:
Yes, but as few will be selling, many buying and as buying volumes increase dealers working capital needs to increase (which they may not be able to fund). This will mean premiums will increase.

Then on the other side you have many sellers and no buyers, so buyback discounts will blow out, see http://www.chrismartenson.com/page/transcript-robert-mish "In the 1980, when we were about eight weeks backlogged and not everyone even had a refiner relationship and had to rely on other dealers who did, it got to about 30% discount for having the wrong form of silver versus the right form"

So the effective buy/sell spread on either side of that bubble could be quite large, wiping out a lot of profit.
Click to expand...

interesting read. not sure if I read it before. these two quotes stood out for me. turnover should be even simpler in another boom?

Back then, we did not have a lot of mint ready products for people to buy. If you wanted to go invest in gold, the only coin out up to 1979 for gold investing was the Krugerrand. If you wanted to invest in silver, you just took the old US coins in circulation, there was very little modern mint product around, very little refiner product around and the refiners, they were caught by surprise. Today if we want to invest in pure silver, we can buy ten ounce, hundred ounce, or a thousand ounce silver bars. Back then, there was not much of that around, so we were selling just about anything made of silver to the new silver investors, coins that would not normally be thought of as a way to invest in silver.
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Robert Mish: Well the phone calls were ringing so much we could not answer them. We had to just put all our lines on hold so we could service the customers, and our own customers we wanted to service first. We world come in to open at nine in the morning and there would already be a line out the door and down the block. Sometimes the line was mostly buyers, sometimes there were sellers. We would run out of metal, we would run out of anything and we would have to divide the line in two lines. We would take the sellers in first, get some product, sort it while the buyers are walking in and people were not very discriminating then, they were panicking. By the time it peaked in January 1980, there were people out there who did not even understand free market economics or precious metal economics, they were just buying because it was fashionable or because it was going up forever. Those are more the makings of a bubble,
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Things will be easier this time around, but the fact is that when there are more sellers than buyers it doesn't matter what the product is, we are going to have to melt it and turn it into 1000oz silver bars and ship to London where the wholesale market clears.

At that point the most liquid (ie product with least discount) will be 1000oz bars. Everything else will attract the same and larger discount as it will all be melted. Doesn't matter whether it is a good looking coin or rough bar, all will be bought back at the same discount IMO.

Key is to sell well before hand. That will be hard for many because this forum will be overrun with desperate people and the old hands advising to sell will be drowned out.

My recommendation will be if we are seeing premiums going high to sell into it and, if you want to stay on for the ride, buy 1000oz bars at low premium (ie convert into more ounces) or buy into pooled products backed by 1000oz bars which you can sell quickly if you want to catch the peak.
 
bron suchecki said:
goldpelican said:
I've seen "no buying" signs up on more than one occasion at different dealers - liquidity is not an infinite resource.

In the event of manic parabolic prices and you find that local dealers are out of cash, The Perth Mint may be the buyer of last resort in the country.
Click to expand...

I don't think this fact is appreciated by many and it will become a problem if we get into a bubble market and on the other side of it. You may find dealers offering to buy back but with payment delayed as they ship the metal to Perth and only pay out once we pay them.
Click to expand...

Hi GP/Bron

In the event of a parabolic manic phase do you really think there will be a shortage of buyers? That makes no sense to me ? Other asset classes will liquidate to buy in and the PM markets are so tiny that this cant be a real problem? The bullion dealers including the PM may have a liquidity problem but there will be tons of buyers out there. That is the definition. The market cant go parabolic if there is no currency or buyers.
Just my understanding
 
Ronnie 666 said:
In the event of a parabolic manic phase do you really think there will be a shortage of buyers? That makes no sense to me ? Other asset classes will liquidate to buy in and the PM markets are so tiny that this cant be a real problem? The bullion dealers including the PM may have a liquidity problem but there will be tons of buyers out there. That is the definition. The market cant go parabolic if there is no currency or buyers.
Click to expand...

On the way up there is a shortage of sellers, hence the price goes up (and premiums as well). Our comments are more focused on the other side of the bubble, when there is a shortage of buyers.
 
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