Can someone just confirm the rule for me please. Is it that .999 is GST free and less than .999 attracts GST?
Perth Bullion Liquidation
- Thread starter nighttrader
- Start date
Thank you for your reply but I still don't understand sorry.
If its limited edition it becomes a collectors item. If its a generic item like a gold bar or silver round its GST free.
Also agree, unfortunately dont think KJC sell them( unless added recently). Being in Sydney Ifound it more often a lot cheaper not only buying QB's but other coins/bars from Perth bullion including their postage. Up to now not aware of any other dealer in Australia that hold them.
There range was massive and they were one of few to stock a lot of other products from various mints at a reasonable price with no ridiculous premium like a lot of other dealers.
I know there is this forum but for someone that visits acouple of times a week anything that's a half decent deal seems to be swooped up pretty quickly.
There range was massive and they were one of few to stock a lot of other products from various mints at a reasonable price with no ridiculous premium like a lot of other dealers.
I know there is this forum but for someone that visits acouple of times a week anything that's a half decent deal seems to be swooped up pretty quickly.
Sorry was meant to attach this to my post
To the more experienced a question; how is this playing out with coin values?
Are collectable coins like $200 Commonwealth Games and $200 Koala being bought for less to compensate for 10% GST. I'm assuming that if there are 2 coins that are only worth spot and one attracts GST on sale the one that attracts GST is less desirable and therefore worth than spot.
The problem is that the ATO don't understand it. Different people in the ATO have different interpretations. So don't feel bad that it confuses everyone.
Have a read of their paper GSTR 2003/10 to see how confusing it is.
The customs agents that bullion companies use are very stringent in their application, and they okayed pretty much everything that didn't come from the Perth Mint. And stuff from the Perth Mint ..... Well if the Perth Mint doesn't charge GST in its retail shop then it must not be GST liable. After all it is my understanding that the Perth Mint were consulted when the legislation was drafted.
It is fair and reasonable to follow the lead of a government owned entity that has the resources to hire lawyers to appropriately consider and interpret (badly written) legislation. You can't expect the same from a small business of less than 10 employees.
In this case the ATO have targeted a very small group of smaller dealers. Kinda like a test case to see if they can get away with it. PB as well as SGB just happened to be the companies that one particular auditor was assigned.
It must be said that applying the most stringent interpretation, I can't see what PB have done wrong. As Iceblue says, its unfair to interpret things one way for a few companies (and put them out of business) and not for others.
This is what has happened here.
These are not bullion (24k, 999+) and attract GST (refer to prices at ainslie and goldstackers). Hence they have higher premiums at dealers and like you said are not desirable for those looking to buy as close to spot as possible.
It's a disgrace, they have the power to issue a ruling and avoid the confusion. Peoples lives are affected and there are huge knock on effects. This type of thing is like a cancer ripping through an industry.
SilverDJ
Well-Known Member
But up until the last few months Ainslie had been selling $200 coins GST free, with the note on their page reading "Because they are still currency they do not attract GST despite not being 9999 pure."
As far as I know Ainslie were the only ones not charging GST on these, but have changed their tune now. Goldstackers have always charged GST on them.
From the web archive March 4th (they never used to have the (INCL GST) in the title before this.
I did not know this. Seems they are covering their ass due to the overlap of "limited release, non - bullion" with "legal tender" allowing the ATO to claim GST. Definitely needs clarification, although I daresay most dealers will now charge GST to reduce the risk of headache.
I have stuck to 24k .999+ bullion since i became involved in PM due to lower premiums and I presume many more people will now look towards high purity products to avoid this hassle.
If my "boss" fired me for following his procedures in collecting GST, I would sue for unfair dismissal.
SilverDJ
Well-Known Member
They have more money to pay lawyers than you do.
It'd be interesting to know what PB got pinged with. As far as I can remember they have always charged GST on numismatic, proof and non-bullion grade coins and proof-like rounds from private mints.
ATO: No GST? Sweet.... we'll be knocking on their door soon.
SilverDJ
Well-Known Member
Maybe it was coin buy-backs or something related to the GST "gold scam" the happened a few years ago? I believe several legitimate business got caught up in it. But that wouldn't be much money I presume? Likely they weren't charging GST on coins they should have (according the vague ATO rules) They probably appealed it for a while and ultimately lost, and they didn't have the cash to pay up, so was easier and less stress to simply shut down the company and declare bankruptcy. Guess who the 1st priority creditor will be....