More FAKES - Warning 2 Rand Gold South Africa - SMALLER DENOMINATIONS

M

Miloman

Active Member
Silver Stacker
Hi All,

As some of you know I have very reluctant to post about fakes online but a fake 2 gold rand coin finally has come into my hands. We all know about the excessive number of fake Krugerrands in 1oz denomination. But they have struck again.

I am undecided on if to post photos as the fakes are getting so good they are difficult to spot but there are still tell-tale signs of a fake. (I am guarded about telling all the signs as few can tell them save for experts and there are implications for this - the fakers will just improve their method).

So I am just sending out a WARNING about the new fake coins and how they are in smaller denominations.

Further to this...
* They can fool a XRF which I can confirm (sometimes out fractionally too)
* They are the small size which I can confirm (in some cases a little thicker but undetectable for 90% of population)
* They are the same weight (in some cases only out fractionally)

Now to make matters worse... geez
Apparently I have be informed that they can fool a Precious Metals Tester that uses ultrasonic!

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but be careful people, even dealers are getting burnt.

Cheers,
MM
 
Thanks for that. What are they made of to fool XRF and the PMT?
 
Bullion Baron said:
Surprising if a coin <2mm thickness can fool an XRF machine (if tested both sides)... what is the construct i.e. Gold layered over another metal?
Click to expand...

I am not allowed to chop it to find out without the owners permission and it won't be in my possession for much longer.

Should I get the owner's permission and the owner changes their mind on chopping it, I would post the XRF results of the whole operation including before, after of coin and XRF results.

I've chopped up fake 1oz Krugers before and found different compositions.

And yes it can fool an XRF from both sides, rim etc.

The Krugers I've chopped aren't extraordinary thick plating but obviously not a thin plating either.

I also use real coins as comparison along with the most experienced people in the game.

I've shown videos and photos of me chopping and testing coins to fellow senior members but only face to face.
 
Bring it along to this Sunday's meet and lets test it on Boyscout's machine.
I will bring my fisch coin detector for 2 Rand. It can check for thickness and diameter, shape and weight.
Your fake might fail one of those checks.
 
Aurora et luna said:
Bring it along to this Sunday's meet and lets test it on Boyscout's machine.
I will bring my fisch coin detector for 2 Rand. It can check for thickness and diameter, shape and weight.
Your fake might fail one of those checks.
Click to expand...

Ok as long as no destructive tests are done. I am returning the coin on Monday.

I will bring a real 2 rand and 1 rand for comparison.

EDIT:
So yeah that means I will be attending... haha
 
Bullion Baron said:
Please post all results back in the thread. Any chance it could be a jewellers copy i.e. still real Gold.
Click to expand...

Unless a destructive test is performed there is no way to be 100% however...
* Coin is late date not earlier.
* There are no known "jeweler's copies" of these dates.
* It is completely consistent and has all features of fake Krugerrand. This is pretty important! - I'll add a point - It features the same lamina surface of the 1oz.
* Foremost internationally known experts (numismatics) have flagged it as "almost certainly" fake (exact words were "95%+ for sure, you know that!") and would not touch it unless destructive test performed.
* I have real ones and am familiar with them.

So results are already in and they have wanted to perform destructive tests, however it has an owner and the owner has asked for it to be returned.

It seems improbable that it would be solid gold and I have personally chopped coins in highly reputable businesses and have experience with fakes and jewelers copies like sovereigns. These coins have no numismatic value to copy or reason like when they did things like sovereigns.

So there you have it. If it proves to be solid gold, I'd be more than a little surprised.
 
It's probably a tungsten based metal having a similar density to 22K gold. Have you tried the sliding rare earth magnet test? You will need to compare it with a real one to see the difference.
 
milkyspot said:
what makes me suspicious.
why doesnt the owner want to see whats inside?
Click to expand...
Because if the coin is genuine, he would destroy any numismatic premium the coin might have and most likely only get 5% above spot as scrap from the gold buyer.
 
Sorry thats idiotic. Its only a Kruger with no numismatic premium should it be real....If i had it it would be cut up yesterday.

Until its no cut up and investigated i call it hoax, rumors, unconfirmed suspicision.:rolleyes:
 
Miloman said:
Hi All,

As some of you know I have very reluctant to post about fakes online but a fake 2 gold rand coin finally has come into my hands. We all know about the excessive number of fake Krugerrands in 1oz denomination. But they have struck again.

I am undecided on if to post photos as the fakes are getting so good they are difficult to spot but there are still tell-tale signs of a fake. (I am guarded about telling all the signs as few can tell them save for experts and there are implications for this - the fakers will just improve their method).

So I am just sending out a WARNING about the new fake coins and how they are in smaller denominations.

Further to this...
* They can fool a XRF which I can confirm (sometimes out fractionally too)
* They are the small size which I can confirm (in some cases a little thicker but undetectable for 90% of population)
* They are the same weight (in some cases only out fractionally)

Now to make matters worse... geez
Apparently I have be informed that they can fool a Precious Metals Tester that uses ultrasonic!

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but be careful people, even dealers are getting burnt.

Cheers,
MM
Click to expand...

I don't understand. If its fooled an XRF how do you know its fake? What did the XRF actually say that 'gave the game away?
 
is there a possibility there is something different from tungsten internally? Maybe even an alloy of gold and something else to fool the tests?
 
I don't know what's inside this particular one. I've chopped up coins and have video, photographic evidence both of the coin and xrf test and how I spotted them.

I can only tell you that the OWNER of the coin stated that it passed the PMT, I have not tested these coins with a PMT only an XRF.

I haven't been wrong yet. Though I am happy to be proven wrong. However we have more than one opinion here.

Oh in the other cases police were called and major dealers witnessed etc. Its a big deal.

EDIT:
They have used different compositions and they have changed over time. If we assume the owner is correct then they have found a way to fool PMTs. I have no experience with PMT, mainly recognizing them and chopping them. XRF is only useful to a point.

BTW there are those on this board that can verify to evidence I speak of. I'm just not going to publish it for obvious reasons and have been asked not to.
 
I like how the information is hoarded to feed the OPs superiority complex. You losers are not worthy of direct and factual information. Only suggestive innuendo which should never be questioned. All bow down to King Milo!
 
Ok let me summarize:

A fake coin which passes XRF, Ultrasonic and everything else but its not further investigated because of numismatic value?!?!?! and lots of other excuses...........

Better place a warning with rumors without beeing 100% sure.

nothing_to_do_here_by_rober_raik-d4cxltj.png

Source:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top