Markets preparing for US government shutdown

goldpelican

Well-Known Member
Silver Stacker
As a last-minute deal to resolve tense spending negotiations in Washington appeared less and less likely, US stock investors braced for an outcome that had previously seemed thinkable: a shutdown of the US government.

The House of Representatives early Sunday voted for an emergency spending bill that includes a delay of President Barack Obama's healthcare reform laws despite veto threats from the White House.

While a deal could be reached before the government's fiscal year ends at midnight on Monday, the unanimous passage of a bill to continue paying US soldiers in the event the government runs out of money was viewed as a sign that there would be no agreement between Republicans, who hold a majority in the House, and the Democrats, who control the White House and Senate.

A shutdown is expected to have a catastrophic impact on markets, injecting massive amounts of uncertainty into major asset classes. If the shutdown is prolonged, it could also have significant implications for economic growth. Many government employees will be furloughed, and the Labor Department said it would not issue its monthly employment report scheduled for next Friday.

"Markets had been expecting an 11th hour resolution, but it seems increasingly clear that won't happen, which means all bets are off," said Kristina Hooper, head of portfolio strategies at Allianz Global Investors in New York. "Investors need to become more comfortable with volatility."

While the threat of a shutdown has weighed on markets recently, with the S&P 500 snapping a three-week streak of gains to fall 1.1 per cent last week, many investors considered the prospect unlikely. The S&P is up 3 per cent this month, and is a mere 2 per cent away from its all-time high.

The CBOE Volatility index spiked about 18 per cent last week, but remains down 14 per cent on the year, suggesting little of the fear is priced into markets.

Analysts had viewed a shutdown as unlikely, with many citing other government stalemates that were resolved in the past few years. However, political infighting in 2011 prompted the loss of the United States' triple-A credit rating and was the primary driver of the stock market's last full-on correction.

"A shutdown is just one domino; if it falls, it will cause a series of unknowns, and those unknowns are impossible to quantify," said Adam Sarhan, chief executive of Sarhan Capital in New York, citing the risk of a US government debt default.

Historically, Wall Street has managed to avoid steep downside during similar incidents. During the federal government shutdown from December 15, 1995, to January 6, 1996, the S&P 500 added 0.1 per cent. During the November 13 to November 19, 1995, shutdown, the benchmark index rose 1.3 per cent, according to data by Jason Goepfert, president of SentimenTrader.com.

That precedent may not hold this time given that growth continues to lag. The US Federal Reserve recently held off on slowing its stimulus program, saying economic growth was not meeting its targets.

Since the market is near all-time highs and has seen little in the way of a sustained pullback this year, Sarhan said the downside potential was vast, with major indexes "slicing through" resistance levels.

"The immediate shock could be 200 Dow points, could be 1,000 Dow points. Those moves may be exaggerated at first, but if things aren't resolved quickly that could just be the start."

Essentially all market sectors could see a reaction to a shutdown, with industries tied to the pace of economic growth- like energy and financials- seeing outsized impacts.

The defensive sector "will feel an immediate impact since its biggest customer is the US government," said Sarhan. "We're talking billions of dollars in income. If that goes away, what could replace that?"

Even utilities, which are considered a defensive group, may see steep moves if a shutdown impacts interest rates.

Among other asset classes, the uncertainty could been a boon for US Treasuries as investors seek shelter. Benchmark 10-year Treasury notes rose 10/32 on Friday, with yields easing to 2.62 per cent.

Even if a last-minute deal is reached, investors face a second Washington cliffhanger as Congress must agree to increase the $16.7 trillion ($17.9 trillion) limit on federal borrowing by October 17. If Capitol Hill fails to act in time, the unthinkable could happen and the United States could default on its debts.

"We're in a game of chicken. Once it became clear that people were willing to risk Federal employee jobs, that's when it became a real concern," said Len Blum, managing partner of Westwood Capital LLC in New York.

"We've become somewhat desensitised to this kind of apocalyptical thing coming out of D.C., but as time goes on with no resolution, it will get increasingly bad."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/mark...nt-shutdown-20130930-2un19.html#ixzz2gJiJBuyX
 
Can anyone recall if they closed down once before? I seem to remember something in the 70's.

The US Debt level had apparently been frozen for quite a few weeks as the powers did accounting tricks and pillaged every reserve possible. This could really happen this time.

I also read somewhere that after Obama and Merkel were re-elected they'd move forward with their plans. Clive Maund's Out of the Box had a very good article on the positioning of the CHY as a reserve currency and the rapid establishment of Shanghai as a finance centre, along with the already strong Hong Kong centre, and it's positioning to take over the role of the USD.

Collapse or at least reconfiguring, of the western economies (which closure of the US government would hasten) seems assured and the rise of the East the inevitable result, however Maund also argues that the USA is such a powerhouse economy that a changeover could be a long way off.

In answer to which I would say that it's all a little too fragile and has been since 2008. Derivatives is the fox in the hen house.

Keep stacking folks.
 
JulieW said:
Can anyone recall if they closed down once before? I seem to remember something in the 70's.

Wikipedia states the US Government has shut down 17 times since 1976! Seems like it's a regular occurrence, although some of them were only partial shutdowns and/or limited duration (1-3 days): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_shutdown#List_of_government_shutdowns

The most recent was in 1995-1996, with two shutdowns totalling 28 days: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_government_shutdown_of_1995_and_1996
 
Nothing new... the US Government was shutdown back in 1996 for about 2 weeks... can't remember the shutdown date... but the restart date was Monday, January 8, 1996... I know, I was there.

Edit -
whinfell said:
The most recent was in 1995-1996, with two shutdowns totalling 28 days: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_government_shutdown_of_1995_and_1996

Was personally involved in this shut-down, just could not remember the exact dates, except the Monday morning when the USA reopened for business.
 
A lot less government for a few days or weeks sounds like a libertarian's holiday even if it is mostly bureaucrats that are affected.
 
As Mark Thornton said recently, a government shutdown won't actually "shut down" the US Government. Vast swathes of the government will still continue to operate as per normal - military, post office, tax collection, treasury, law enforcement, social security, veterans welfare, hospitals, prisons, the court system etc will still be operating. It's only a few non-essential aspects that'll shut down. So it's not actually "shutting down".
 
Biggest outrage during the Clinton Govt shutdown was from holidaymakers when the National Parks shutdown.

how do you shut down a forest?

p.s.
The unanimous vote against an Armed Forces pay freeze just shows that;
1) they intend to shut down Govt. again
&
2) despite the fact that their armed forces are the major cause of their debt burden, they haven't the stomach to take on 'The Generals'.

They're (and we're) doomed!
 
Clawhammer said:
The unanimous vote against an Armed Forces pay freeze just shows that;
1) they intend to shut down Govt. again
&
2) despite the fact that their armed forces are the major cause of their debt burden, they haven't the stomach to take on 'The Generals'.

I know I'll start an argument here but the largest cause of the debt burden is welfare and 'entitlement' spending. Shutting down the government - including military salaries and maintenance - does not solve the problem of too much money being spent on welfare.

Everyone seems to love bashing the military but it's not the biggest problem.


(Please limit cries of 'warmonger' and quoting the phrase 'military industrial complex' to once per reply)
 
AngloSaxon said:
Clawhammer said:
The unanimous vote against an Armed Forces pay freeze just shows that;
1) they intend to shut down Govt. again
&
2) despite the fact that their armed forces are the major cause of their debt burden, they haven't the stomach to take on 'The Generals'.

I know I'll start an argument here but the largest cause of the debt burden is welfare and 'entitlement' spending. Shutting down the government - including military salaries and maintenance - does not solve the problem of too much money being spent on welfare.

Everyone seems to love bashing the military but it's not the biggest problem.


(Please limit cries of 'warmonger' and quoting the phrase 'military industrial complex' to once per reply)

It just came from one of Kyle Bass' seminars where he showed the US's expenditure in terms of "3 buckets" of money.
1) Non-Discretionary (Pensions, Roads, Health Schools etc)
2) Non-Defence Discretionary (Pork Barrelling)
3) Defence

It now takes all of the nation's tax-revenue to fill just the first bucket... the other two are funded by borrowing.
 
AngloSaxon said:
Clawhammer said:
The unanimous vote against an Armed Forces pay freeze just shows that;
1) they intend to shut down Govt. again
&
2) despite the fact that their armed forces are the major cause of their debt burden, they haven't the stomach to take on 'The Generals'.

I know I'll start an argument here but the largest cause of the debt burden is welfare and 'entitlement' spending. Shutting down the government - including military salaries and maintenance - does not solve the problem of too much money being spent on welfare.

Everyone seems to love bashing the military but it's not the biggest problem.


(Please limit cries of 'warmonger' and quoting the phrase 'military industrial complex' to once per reply)

Well according to this graph the problem is not welfare OR defence, it is actually "everything else" http://www.google.com.au/imgres?img...a=X&ei=ygNJUq-DMYWAiQfv9ICADA&ved=0CFYQ9QEwBQ

If they just got rid of "everything else" in the budget the deficit would be quite manageable. :)
 
AngloSaxon said:
Clawhammer said:
The unanimous vote against an Armed Forces pay freeze just shows that;
1) they intend to shut down Govt. again
&
2) despite the fact that their armed forces are the major cause of their debt burden, they haven't the stomach to take on 'The Generals'.

I know I'll start an argument here but the largest cause of the debt burden is welfare and 'entitlement' spending. Shutting down the government - including military salaries and maintenance - does not solve the problem of too much money being spent on welfare.

Everyone seems to love bashing the military but it's not the biggest problem.


(Please limit cries of 'warmonger' and quoting the phrase 'military industrial complex' to once per reply)

Have a read of this: New lie: The government spends more on welfare than everything else!
 
TheEnd said:
O.k and when is MSM going to talk about this happening? So far I have heard NOTHING?

The first post has a link to Sydney Morning Herald. Is that main-stream enough?
 
willrocks said:
TheEnd said:
O.k and when is MSM going to talk about this happening? So far I have heard NOTHING?

The first post has a link to Sydney Morning Herald. Is that main-stream enough?

When I talk about MSM I mean the television and the 6 o'clock news.....Not everyone has time to surf the net all day searching for the latest news......MOST people are at work struggling to make a living.
 
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