Lets play "Grade That Florin"- 1927 edition

Looks like cleaned VF or perhaps gVF.

By the way, the steps are not an indication of grade, but rather an indication of quality of strike. You can and do see gem graded parliaments with just two or even one and a half steps. Perhaps as more coins were struck with a pair of dies the detail in that area wore off, or perhaps it got filled with grease or debris, or perhaps they just didn't have the pressure on the press wound up high enough.
 
aEF, possibly cleaned
This is a very popular George V coin (2.0 mil), many were pulled from circulation because of its fantastic design and as such most gradeable strikes dont attract high premiums, the normal COA 1927 strike (1.42mil) in that grade attains much higher values
Lovely coin, thanks for sharing:)
 
here is my favourite ms 64
7864_27_canberra_b.jpg
 
BulkCoins15 said:
I find it hard to accept, the definition of the 'MS' grades ...

Eg. with the above ...

The rim knocks and sections of 'flattened' rim - especially at 1-2 o'clock.
The disturbance to the toning.
The 'dig' / 'cut' just above the '27' of the year.
The 'flattened' ding at about 11 o'clock on the 'scroll' (?)
etc.

At one time, I would have chucked the above into a bowl of Silver-Dip !!!!
Click to expand...
they are called bag marks and are part of the reason it only got a 64, the disturbance to the toning is not as a result of being physically altered but just the way the toning has landed on this coin.
as for the term rim knock, this is a rim knock
7864_rim_knock.jpg

you need to be able to distinguish between the different points of ms from 60-70 and remember that a coin doesn't have to be circulated to get damaged slightly eg bag marks
this particular coin is a gem of an example with 3 steps and great eye appeal
 
bja said:
Thats pmd not a rim knock

Is that your 64 serial?
Click to expand...
Yes it is, I purchased it raw and got it graded.
64 is not that uncommon but this has awesome rim toning (better in hand of course) and 3 steps which is hard to find
Look at how American early silver coins recognize things like this like full strap dimes. Adds value to the coin to a informed collector
 
BulkCoins15 said:
When I said "disturbance to the toning", I was referring to the section of the coin between 6 & 9 o'clock.

To me, it looks like the coin has had something rub against this area on different occasions.

I was speaking with a dealer about MS grades recently ...

Some people swear-by the grading criteria, and won't accept any criticism of it !!
Click to expand...
most old Australian coin dealers hate pcgs as they have a heap of stock that wouldn't make it in a problem free slab as it was common for coins to be routinely cleaned in the 70's and 80's through a process called whizzing.
Some still list coins as unc or gem when they are polished crap, that's why they hate having a third party service make it hard for them to peddle there crap.
Thing is a picture can only show so much, for instance the area you are referring to has immaculate original surfaces with full mint state lustre, you wouldn't say the little spots in the toning are cleaned/worn areas would you?
it is simply a place where the toning has occurred differently giving it character, I could however dip this coin to a blast white (again another common dealer practise) but it would ruin the coin in my eye
I will repeat the important fact, I bought this coin raw, I didn't buy a slab, I recognised it potential and got it slabbed. I review many coins and believe I have a good eye for a high grade coin having picked many ms coins from dealer files that they neglected because they are toned, most old school coin dealers cant grade for sht but they sure as hell like to say a coin they bought as vf is aUnc when they got to sell it

This is a beautiful coin and is one of my favourite Australian coins, it is far from my most valuable but I like it
 
BulkCoins15 said:
What I meant was, that it's some dealers of PCGS slabbed coins who fully believe that any grade attributed to a coin, is absolutely true and correct in every detail.

I've heard from a number of other sellers, that PCGS coins be either 'over-graded' or 'under-graded' ....

Not implying that your particular '27 isn't nice though ...
Click to expand...
I actually agree that some ms64's are better than others, you must always buy the coin not the slab, having said that the point of slabbing is to enable transparency in the industry, it is easier to buy a coin online knowing that it has had an independent 3rd party assign it a grade and it isn't going to be to far either side of the condition report. compared to how dealers used to operate where coins were traded based on the dealers opinion that quite often varied and collector to collector transactions were harder, less common and not encouraged.
Auction houses have been losers as well unless they embrace the graded coins as they often have poor grading skills, no refund policies and average pictures on their raw coins. at least with a graded coin you know the condition and can bid accordingly, if you find the coin to be massively over graded you can lodge a claim against PCGS and they will pay the difference in value.
Third party graders empower the collector at the expense of the old big fish in the industry and I think that's a good thing
 
This Centenary Florin is one of my prized numi coins in my collection. I purchased this raw as well and personally would call it UNC but would anyone here like to put a MS number to it.
I know these are common in a high grade but to my eye this one is special because of the toning :)
Photo's are not the greatest but please let me know what you think.


Source:
3523_grading_007.jpg

Source:
3523_grading_004.jpg
 
Some of the tone looks a bit like dip residue, hard to tell from the photos. Are there any hairlines on the coin?

Going by the photo and if it hasnt been cleaned I would guess a 62/63.

Over to serial
 
bja said:
Some of the tone looks a bit like dip residue, hard to tell from the photos. Are there any hairlines on the coin?

Going by the photo and if it hasnt been cleaned I would guess a 62/63.

Over to serial
Click to expand...
you raise the same concerns I have, however this coin is known to have unusual and dark tones due to the sulphur rich foy bags they were often sold and stored in.
unfortunately your pictures are not good enough to grade this coin within 6 points eg it could range 6 point either side of ms61
have you got a fixed macro setting on you camera?
 
oh and btw the highest graded (eg 66/67) ones often are dark and covered in tone like yours
 
Thanks guys I will try and get some better pics.
If it was only a ms 61/62 do you think it would still be worth getting it graded?
 
SilverSurfer77 said:
Thanks guys I will try and get some better pics.
If it was only a ms 61/62 do you think it would still be worth getting it graded?
Click to expand...
I think any ms problem free coin in this series is worth the cost of grading, they are often cleaned by novices and as such are not gradable
plus the new pcgs slabs are great storage media and they do true view pics on all secure grading now so my answer would be that spending $40 to get it graded is a good idea.
 
serial said:
SilverSurfer77 said:
Thanks guys I will try and get some better pics.
If it was only a ms 61/62 do you think it would still be worth getting it graded?
Click to expand...
I think any ms problem free coin in this series is worth the cost of grading, they are often cleaned by novices and as such are not gradable
plus the new pcgs slabs are great storage media and they do true view pics on all secure grading now so my answer would be that spending $40 to get it graded is a good idea.
Click to expand...

In Australia, who is the best (most trust worthy) person to use to get it PCGS graded?
 
Eric is a good fellow had a few talks on the phone although never meet in person.
but i end up get my coins graded by NGC instead of PCGS (which i think Drake Sterling only do PCGS?)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top