GSR to the moon!

SilverDJ said:
HoldMeTender said:
And if you don't withdraw dollars, but bullion??? As I said above, say $500 goes in and 2kg of gold comes out... what then?
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If you put $500 in and you don't do anything else, and out pops 2kg of gold because, you know, the moon, then you haven't sold the gold, therefore you have not made a capital gain.
Just like buying shares and they go to the moon, it's not a capital gain until you sell them.
But of course the interesting point is can you "cash out" gold instead of cash? That's one hairy question.
If you put money into unallocated and then "cash out" with a physical brick, then I don't think you have actually cashed out, and in that case it wouldn't be a CGT event.
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No moon required, just my amazing GSR swap skills :0 Let's be (more) realistic, say I could convert $500 to 1oz gold, as a result of numerous trades in unallocated. But basically you're saying: yes, the trades are taxable.

Withdrawing bullion is a simple matter of paying the necessary fabrication premium and collecting your bars (if you're lucky enough to live in Perth that is). As far as I understand it, you already 'own' the metal, though I'm sure there are conditions and caveats more knowledgeable or paranoid members can point out.
 
HoldMeTender said:
No moon required, just my amazing GSR swap skills :0 Let's be (more) realistic, say I could convert $500 to 1oz gold, as a result of numerous trades in unallocated. But basically you're saying: yes, the trades are taxable.
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Yes, I think if you ask the ATO for a ruling, they would say that each transaction from asset (metal) to cash (even if inside the PM account) is potentially a CGT event.
What I'm talking about is potentially grouping those events together as one big CGT event.
If you want to put money in, trade to your hearts content cash->metal->cash->metal->cash->metal, and then pull out a lump of gold and think you can get away with it without ever paying any CGT, I think the ATO would want a piece of that action.

Withdrawing bullion is a simple matter of paying the necessary fabrication premium and collecting your bars (if you're lucky enough to live in Perth that is). As far as I understand it, you already 'own' the metal, though I'm sure there are conditions and caveats more knowledgeable or paranoid members can point out.
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Yes, you already own the "asset". If you put money in, accumulate metal, and then withdraw the physical metal, you haven't sold anything, you have just accumulated an asset. You do not pay GCT unless you sell an asset.
 
A GSR bubble may be forming.


When is it going to pop?


Will we see 100 before it bursts and comes hurling back down to earth?



.
 
billybob888 said:
Geeez

Gsr shot up to 83 overnight
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Yup, if I had waited until the evening to do my swap I would have made an additional 6oz of silver in the trade. Nevermind, if it keeps going up I will start looking down the back of the sofa for any loose gold change.

Is it time to resurrect my GSR Conspiracy Theory?

Here goes.

Banks want the gold back, they tried confiscation back in the 30's and got a fair bit back, but not everyone complied and people kept their jewellery and it was only people in the USA who were targeted.

So then they tried to make gold irrelevant, it was no longer currency, stories were circulated that Fort Knox and the Central Banks had all offloaded their gold supplies and the price of gold was kept artificially low to discourage interest in it. This gave them time to start buying up while the prices were low.

So then 'they' 'manipulated' the meteoric price rise of gold a few years back to get people to melt down the family jewellery, first all the broken necklaces and pocket watches would have been offloaded but as the prices rose even higher people would have sold the broaches that were 'old fashioned' or the rings they didn't wear. As prices continued to rise the public sold off everything they could get their hands on.

But of course, while this was going on, lots of new investors jumped on the gold bandwagon.

In order to get the gold back from these new investors 'they' 'manipulated' the crash, thousands of people lost their investments as they raced to sell the gold before prices dropped much further, and 'they' bought the gold for cheap.

Now there are far fewer ounces being held in private hands. 'they' know that there is a die hard group of believers who won't trade their gold for fiat, but 'they' want that anyway. They have orchestrated several GSR spikes overs the decades to encourage people to swap their gold for a bucket of silver. This is just the latest.

The final steps;
1. Force people to transfer their savings for retirement into government hands.

Before state welfare and easy credit you had to save money over your entire life in order to fund your retirement, plus have a large well-knit family.

Then the welfare state came along and you no longer needed to save or rely on family for your retirement, you had the state.

You could now give all your savings to your kids and pass on your wealth down the generations.

So the state introduced a forced saving scheme which they could regulate and legislate for their own purposes. So instead of people putting their savings in a bank and using them however they pleased whenever they wanted, they diverted this money into the compulsory superannuation funds. The gov is now back in control of your wealth and can dictate how and when you spend it.

People who would normally buy gold for their stack can now buy gold and put it in the SMSF instead. The state now knows who has the gold and how much they have, they can audit at any time they like and they can change the legislation at the request of 'them'. They could for instance, mandate that all PMs in a SMSF need to be stored in an accredited storage facility, and they are the ones who decide on which facilities fit the bill. Once the gold has been delivered to these government facilities a change can be made to the SMSF legislation and all the PMs can be compulsory purchased for fiat (once the prices have been driven down)

2. Demonise PMs

Say that terrorists, communists, drug cartels, kiddie fiddlers or whoever the latest bogeyman is, are using gold in their nefarious deeds. Get the public to be suspicious of anyone with gold

3. ???

4. Profit!
 
Jislizard said:
billybob888 said:
Geeez

Gsr shot up to 83 overnight
Click to expand...

Yup, if I had waited until the evening to do my swap I would have made an additional 6oz of silver in the trade. Nevermind, if it keeps going up I will start looking down the back of the sofa for any loose gold change.

Is it time to resurrect my GSR Conspiracy Theory?

Here goes.

Banks want the gold back, they tried confiscation back in the 30's and got a fair bit back, but not everyone complied and people kept their jewellery and it was only people in the USA who were targeted.

So then they tried to make gold irrelevant, it was no longer currency, stories were circulated that Fort Knox and the Central Banks had all offloaded their gold supplies and the price of gold was kept artificially low to discourage interest in it. This gave them time to start buying up while the prices were low.

So then 'they' 'manipulated' the meteoric price rise of gold a few years back to get people to melt down the family jewellery, first all the broken necklaces and pocket watches would have been offloaded but as the prices rose even higher people would have sold the broaches that were 'old fashioned' or the rings they didn't wear. As prices continued to rise the public sold off everything they could get their hands on.

But of course, while this was going on, lots of new investors jumped on the gold bandwagon.

In order to get the gold back from these new investors 'they' 'manipulated' the crash, thousands of people lost their investments as they raced to sell the gold before prices dropped much further, and 'they' bought the gold for cheap.

Now there are far fewer ounces being held in private hands. 'they' know that there is a die hard group of believers who won't trade their gold for fiat, but 'they' want that anyway. They have orchestrated several GSR spikes overs the decades to encourage people to swap their gold for a bucket of silver. This is just the latest.

The final steps;
1. Force people to transfer their savings for retirement into government hands.

Before state welfare and easy credit you had to save money over your entire life in order to fund your retirement, plus have a large well-knit family.

Then the welfare state came along and you no longer needed to save or rely on family for your retirement, you had the state.

You could now give all your savings to your kids and pass on your wealth down the generations.

So the state introduced a forced saving scheme which they could regulate and legislate for their own purposes. So instead of people putting their savings in a bank and using them however they pleased whenever they wanted, they diverted this money into the compulsory superannuation funds. The gov is now back in control of your wealth and can dictate how and when you spend it.

People who would normally buy gold for their stack can now buy gold and put it in the SMSF instead. The state now knows who has the gold and how much they have, they can audit at any time they like and they can change the legislation at the request of 'them'. They could for instance, mandate that all PMs in a SMSF need to be stored in an accredited storage facility, and they are the ones who decide on which facilities fit the bill. Once the gold has been delivered to these government facilities a change can be made to the SMSF legislation and all the PMs can be compulsory purchased for fiat (once the prices have been driven down)

2. Demonise PMs

Say that terrorists, communists, drug cartels, kiddie fiddlers or whoever the latest bogeyman is, are using gold in their nefarious deeds. Get the public to be suspicious of anyone with gold

3. ???

4. Profit!
Click to expand...


I have bought into your Conspiracy Theory immediately :) best part compulsory superannuation ! So many people adding extra to their super funds but cant afford to pay extra off their mortgage payments or credit card debt? Doesnt make sense to me to sacrifice more now for when you least need more? propaganda brainwashing!
 
Proper Gander said:
The last few years a lot of the physical gold has flowed to China though. How does that fit the conspiracy?
Click to expand...

China has banks, bankers don't care about politics, they don't take sides, they will finance both sides in a war. The banks are all gearing up to the gold standard to ensure that no single country can unbalance the plan by getting too much of the gold.

When the bankers have the gold they will run the politicians who run the countries.
 
SilverDJ said:
FlashInThePan said:
If you were to trade one metal for another (physical for physical) a transaction that yields no profit, then from a taxation point of view, there is nothing to report?
Click to expand...

I guess it would then become barter, which is subject to tax:
https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/GST...-transactions/Bartering-and-barter-exchanges/

They don't say anything about CGT though. So like that guy who traded a red paperclip for a house, it's probably not CGT liable?
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Exchanging money would not be a form of barter IMHO.
Barter appears to occur through a trading corporation where a service fee is applied.
Gold and silver is recognised in the Constitution.
 
As I have said, physical supply contraints on Ag limits how high the GSR can go.
A dynamic situation - so no certainty the GSR peak has just happened (eg, if extra Ag is suddenly available).
Just my opinion.
 
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