Gold is Not Money
- Thread starter Luker
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FlashInThePan
Member
Looks to me gold and silver coinage is right in the supreme law of the land that constrains and limits the extent of government power.
Section 51 (xii) is a subsection of Section 51 of the Constitution of Australia that gives the Commonwealth Parliament the right to legislate with respect to "currency, coinage, and legal tender."
Generally, powers in section 51 of the Constitution of Australia can also be legislated on by the states, although Commonwealth law will prevail in cases of inconsistency. However, the currency power must be read in conjunction with other parts of the Constitution of Australia. Section 115 of the Constitution establishes "a state shall not coin money, nor make anything but gold or silver coin a legal tender in the payment of debts". This section effectively makes the concurrent power in section 51(xii) exclusive to the Commonwealth.
Despite this, coins of the Australian pound were not introduced until 1910. From 1901 to 1910 the states could not issue tender and the Commonwealth had not issued tender, so private currency was used as the common medium of exchange whilst the British pound sterling was the national unit of account.
Section 51 (xii) is a subsection of Section 51 of the Constitution of Australia that gives the Commonwealth Parliament the right to legislate with respect to "currency, coinage, and legal tender."
Generally, powers in section 51 of the Constitution of Australia can also be legislated on by the states, although Commonwealth law will prevail in cases of inconsistency. However, the currency power must be read in conjunction with other parts of the Constitution of Australia. Section 115 of the Constitution establishes "a state shall not coin money, nor make anything but gold or silver coin a legal tender in the payment of debts". This section effectively makes the concurrent power in section 51(xii) exclusive to the Commonwealth.
Despite this, coins of the Australian pound were not introduced until 1910. From 1901 to 1910 the states could not issue tender and the Commonwealth had not issued tender, so private currency was used as the common medium of exchange whilst the British pound sterling was the national unit of account.
It's a pretty piss poor argument that the author puts forward anyway. It rests solely upon the justification that the definition of money can only be found by looking at how it is used in today's society. He's confused money with currency.
FlashInThePan
Member
Yes the author has no reference point to guide him other than the present world of paper insanity. So it must be true then!
volrathy said:
Yes, and those are pretty good money too !!! And according to Gresham's law, since they are so good, they have been driven out of circulation (unless, of course, you want to contribute to their circulation by spending them for their face value)
And this is also the reason why governments stamp a ridiculous face value on legal tender gold and silver coins : to avoid that they become bad money.
Some silver coins risk to become bad money, though.... for example the silver maple leaf with face value of 5 CAD. If silver as commodity goes ever under 5 CAD, the maples will become bad money and will flood the market, pushing away 5 CAD notes and lower.
mmissinglink
Active Member
Gold does not function like money today in most cases and is not treated as money by most people or by most institutions. There are, of course, exceptions to the rule.
And remember, while gold has intrinsic properties and characteristics, gold has no intrinsic value. All and any value that gold may have is the value we attach to it individually or collectively. The value attached varies widely (by location and by person) and that value fluctuates significantly (based on varying conditions and by time).
Since enough people will attach significant value to gold for a very long time, I believe, owning some is a good thing.
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And remember, while gold has intrinsic properties and characteristics, gold has no intrinsic value. All and any value that gold may have is the value we attach to it individually or collectively. The value attached varies widely (by location and by person) and that value fluctuates significantly (based on varying conditions and by time).
Since enough people will attach significant value to gold for a very long time, I believe, owning some is a good thing.
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serial said:
25$ for 25$ from RCM? Those are an interesting experiment! But because they are only 1/4oz it's difficult that they will become "good money" anytime soon.... so they basically will be normal legal tender coins "bad money" for the foreseeable future. Now, if they were 25$ legal tender with almost 25$ of silver on them, I would give away all the fiat I have to get them (see? Fiat = bad money would go into circulation and good money silver coins would disappear into my SDB)
In 1996 I put a $200 gold coin on a roulette table at the Perth casino. I asked for 'cash fives' the croupier gave me a $1 chip, I said, 'cash fives' please. Yeah I knew he assumed it was a one dollar coin but I didn't bother to point that out because it's all part of my strategy of focussing attention on my chip.
Anyway the gf was with me and was finding it a little uncomfortable as I just kept asking for 'no, I said cash fives'. Eventually the croupier twigged and said, 'we don't accept that here, you'll have to go to the cashier and change it'. I said what? you don't accept cash money. A casino that does not accept cash?, I want to talk to the pit boss".
After a while the pit boss comes over and the gf has gone outside to have her conniptions in private. He tries to explain that it's a commemorative coin and that it's not legal tender, I insist that it is legal tender, this went on for a while, and he tried to then say that they didn't have anywhere to put it. Eventually he agreed that he could put it in the slot with the other money and told the croupier to cash it in and I asked for $25 dollar chips because I didn't want to hang around at the table. I just play single numbers and on the third number it came up and I got $875 and left.
Gold can be money.
Anyway the gf was with me and was finding it a little uncomfortable as I just kept asking for 'no, I said cash fives'. Eventually the croupier twigged and said, 'we don't accept that here, you'll have to go to the cashier and change it'. I said what? you don't accept cash money. A casino that does not accept cash?, I want to talk to the pit boss".
After a while the pit boss comes over and the gf has gone outside to have her conniptions in private. He tries to explain that it's a commemorative coin and that it's not legal tender, I insist that it is legal tender, this went on for a while, and he tried to then say that they didn't have anywhere to put it. Eventually he agreed that he could put it in the slot with the other money and told the croupier to cash it in and I asked for $25 dollar chips because I didn't want to hang around at the table. I just play single numbers and on the third number it came up and I got $875 and left.
Gold can be money.
Well when you describe scenarios like that, it's amazing that the greater population aren't all using gold for everyday transactions. Still I'll continue to view gold as the commodity it is and trade it like one.
Caput Lupinum said:
That's all it is at the moment.
@ bland, nice story and a nice profit too going on 1996's price of about $550/oz.
I live in the moment 
I don't rely on hypothetical gold bug wet dream scenarios where the fiat system collapses and everyone holds hands in a circle singing kumbaya
I don't rely on hypothetical gold bug wet dream scenarios where the fiat system collapses and everyone holds hands in a circle singing kumbaya
systematic
Well-Known Member
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Dj9v9s9buk[/youtube]
At 50s Bernanke doesn't think Treasury bills are money .... at 1.00 he says (gold) is "tradition" .... they should have arrested and thrown the sob's in jail ....
systematic
Well-Known Member
Caput Lupinum said:
Central banks stack gold because it is an asset ....