Exactly the situation many here claim to STACK FOR.

sure, let them come and claim my coins!
I'll melt everything and make a giant brick and rapper style chains so it's not coins anymore.
 
I'm in agreement with those who maintain that this is the exact scenario why you stack in the first place - wealth preservation when there is no confidence in the local currency.

Having said that, I think it also raises an interesting question in regards to bars vs coins. Part of people's thinking in regards to stacking coins (other than for aesthetic or collection purposes) is that they make up smaller denominations of currency and hence would be easier to trade/barter with.

I think this argument is flawed because as the Greek example shows, the PMs will not be used for direct trade/barter. There are two basic scenarios:

1. You need to sell your PMs in order to buy necessities. If you are put into this situation, you will almost certainly have to take whatever offer is on the table, and I can guarantee that you will not get back the premium you paid for the coins. In fact in this scenario you will be doing very well to get near spot. I would bet that you'll receive the same amount per oz regardless whether its a 100oz bar or a 1oz coin.

2. You hold onto the PMs until after the country/economy/currency stabilises and then want to sell to "realise" your hidden wealth. Depending on how soon after the stabilisation you want to sell, the scenario above may play out here too. If you wait longer, then you may get your premiums paid for the coins back, however it really defeats the original intent of having smaller denominations for trade/barter.

I guess what I'm saying is that you're better off going for maximum ounces at low premiums when buying because if the SHTF there is a good chance you'll lose the premiums you paid. Just my 2c.
 
I go for coins (bullions) for liquidity, not for any other reasons. I prefer to have 1oz pieces and at that size there is really no much difference between coins and bar prices (at least here) so I pick coins because they give me additional peace of mind about their authenticity (tests are much easier than on bars, even by simple visual inspection). I bought a couple of 10oz PM bars and then I immediately regretted it because there was not much difference in price compared to a tube of 20 coins; also, the occupied space is approximately the same but the tubes stack much better.
 
I stack to prepare for the coming alien invasion. Extraterrestrials don't believe in fiat.
 
Less than 50c/oz more (NZD) for coins/rounds. Not enough difference in my opinion. For coins I mean Niue lunars, Niue turtles, or silver fern rounds from NZ mint.
 
sterling-nz said:
Silverthorn said:
sterling-nz said:
Exactly my point, PM's WERE USELESS
Click to expand...

Way to ignore his point about the pawn shop.
Click to expand...
Where is the guy at the pawn shop getting his money?
Where are they finding the money to travel to another country?
Businesses are going to run out of cash as well you know.
This is not just mom and pop that are losing cash access, IT IS EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN Greece.
Sure with PM's you are not losing cash LIKE IN BANKS, BUT the PM;s are NOT going to help you make purchases are they?
Click to expand...

Do you actually think pawn shop owners put their wealth and profits in the bank lol and lol again :) or are you thinking "cash converters franchise owners" lol :)
 
fishtaco said:
Do you actually think pawn shop owners put their wealth and profits in the bank lol and lol again :) or are you thinking "cash converters franchise owners" lol :)
Click to expand...

The current situation in Greece is a pawn shop owner's dream come true. Imagine how many people are pawning/selling wedding rings ... etc. Practically giving them away.
 
SilverPete said:
mmissinglink said:
Porcello said:
Right now it's obvious that PMs in Greece are not useful for daily purchases, but you can't say they are useless because they are still a store of value disconnected from the euro and the potential drachma. I'm pretty sure there is a huge amount of cash available in Greece right now stored under the mattresses... Where do you think all the money disappeared from the banks in the last few months has gone?
Click to expand...


I believe that sterling-nz's point is that silver is effectively useless during a SHTF crisis period....which it is. If someone wants to take sterling-nz's comment literally, then I suppose the argument could be made that a stack of silver could be used as a door stop, rendering the silver technically not entirely useless. :lol:
.
Click to expand...

He's fundentally wrong in attributing a SHTF trading justification to a majority of (Australian) stackers. People with concern for a SHTF event are taking other preparations.

Amongst other reasons, many stackers are seeking to protect themselves from the actions and negative consequences of government, and a belief that there is serious risk in the current financial or monetary systems.
Click to expand...



I think you have misunderstood sterling's point. He writes:
Please NOBODY read this the wrong way.
I am a stacker and i love my coins to pieces.
I just take very serious issue with those people ( and they are many) that believe in times of financial turmoil PM's will be their saving grace.
My "challenge" i guess is to see how those that have stacked and living in Greece can make these metals workfor/save them.
I personally do not think they will save anyone in Greece .
just my views and i truly appreciate everyone taking the time to make all these replies.
Thanks team:)
Click to expand...

His criticism is of those who stack with a primarily belief that in a SHTF scenario, pm's will be extremely valuable to the average stacker. I have run across many stackers who have believed that as well and I would lodge the same criticism of that sort of uncritical and dangerous thinking for similar reasons as sterling has.

Sterling is right to question or criticize that thinking in my view.

I don't profess to speak for sterling-nz but I believe I understand his criticisms well.



I like silver....it's shiny.



.
 
willrocks said:
fishtaco said:
Do you actually think pawn shop owners put their wealth and profits in the bank lol and lol again :) or are you thinking "cash converters franchise owners" lol :)
Click to expand...

The current situation in Greece is a pawn shop owner's dream come true. Imagine how many people are pawning/selling wedding rings ... etc. Practically giving them away.
Click to expand...



Right, and the same probably goes for silver bullion (blobs)...if people are letting go of blobs when there is great turmoil, they are probably practically giving those blobs away and probably losing a lot of value in the process....if they were under the impression, as some stackers are, that silver is a panacea and will save their life in a SHTF scenario.

The smart thing would be to sell many of those blobs long before a serious crisis takes full effect and buy important items that will actually be valuable in a time of serious strife. A stack of kilo bars of silver may serve a purpose in a SHTF situation.....it makes for a pretty door stop. :lol:



.
 
FullMetalFever said:
I'm in agreement with those who maintain that this is the exact scenario why you stack in the first place - wealth preservation when there is no confidence in the local currency.

Having said that, I think it also raises an interesting question in regards to bars vs coins. Part of people's thinking in regards to stacking coins (other than for aesthetic or collection purposes) is that they make up smaller denominations of currency and hence would be easier to trade/barter with.

I think this argument is flawed because as the Greek example shows, the PMs will not be used for direct trade/barter. There are two basic scenarios:

1. You need to sell your PMs in order to buy necessities. If you are put into this situation, you will almost certainly have to take whatever offer is on the table, and I can guarantee that you will not get back the premium you paid for the coins. In fact in this scenario you will be doing very well to get near spot. I would bet that you'll receive the same amount per oz regardless whether its a 100oz bar or a 1oz coin.

2. You hold onto the PMs until after the country/economy/currency stabilises and then want to sell to "realise" your hidden wealth. Depending on how soon after the stabilisation you want to sell, the scenario above may play out here too. If you wait longer, then you may get your premiums paid for the coins back, however it really defeats the original intent of having smaller denominations for trade/barter.

I guess what I'm saying is that you're better off going for maximum ounces at low premiums when buying because if the SHTF there is a good chance you'll lose the premiums you paid. Just my 2c.
Click to expand...

You got it:)
YAY!!!!!!!
 
aleks said:
sterling-nz said:
Well it is all on over in Greece.
Many here , MANY MANY people here say they stack for a financial collapse and Greece has one:(
So my question is, how is silver and gold helping these poor sods with little access to currency?
I am sure all of you that stack for financial collapse will have some BS answer about this being different "somehow", but IT IS NOT.

Those in Greece are in the midst of a of their financial armageddon and with no access to big amounts of cash how are they going to sell their PM's?

Are they going to be bartering with PM's when food gets scarce (and it may very well do), i can not see anyone swapping PM's for their only tins of baked beans.
If stacking for "financial collapse" is actually viable then we should expect to see these PM trades in the news in the next 10 days.
I am taking the piss a tad because WE ARE NOT GOING TO SEE PM's USED IN THIS FINANCIAL collapse of Greece, just like they DID NOT in Argentina.
This IS EXACTLY the situation all those stacking for "financial collapse" would expect to be using them.
When the cash runs completely dry (or close to) and they ARE NOT using PM's will you lot stacking for this reason re-evaluate?
Because if they do not use PM's in this situation, THEN THEY NEVER WILL.
Click to expand...


As a spectator it's not easy to understand the situation in Greece or Argentina. This is not armageddon, don't get me wrong Greece is in severe financial distress but life goes on. People will still need to conduct trade and to do so they need the most liquid medium of exchange in order to satisfy basic human needs of food and shelter. The euro and argentine pesso is an easily divisible unit of account for small ticket items. Had you ever thought what if someone needs to buy and sell a car or a house? If you want to buy an apartment in Buenos Aires today you will see prices in USD. Culturally in south america its not uncommon to do deals in big ticket items with combined payment with cash and barter (yes gold) in normal economic conditions. When it comes to big ticket items people want payment in some sort of reserve asset USD or gold because it represents less risk than holding the local currency. Gold can be used for trade, because it has not been monetized to buy souvlaki does not invalidate its use.
Click to expand...
"As a spectator"?
So you are implying that YOU ONLY HAVE TO LIVE IN Greece to be an expert on the situation?
Like may be only people who have burned down their own homes should become firemen?
Like only those living in poverty should hand out financial advice?
Like only those that beat their partners should hand out advice about domestic abuse?
LOL:)
 
sterling-nz said:
"As a spectator"?
So you are implying that YOU ONLY HAVE TO LIVE IN Greece to be an expert on the situation?
Like may be only people who have burned down their own homes should become firemen?
Like only those living in poverty should hand out financial advice?
Like only those that beat their partners should hand out advice about domestic abuse?
LOL:)
Click to expand...

Oh dear,

No I'm not implying that. But you are making claims regarding the situation in Greece and Argentina which would lead me to believe otherwise.
 
797craig said:
good thread...it would be nice to get a first hand account from a fellow stacker in Greece.
Click to expand...

Thats a better idea than making assumptions...
 
sterling-nz said:
aleks said:
sterling-nz said:
Well it is all on over in Greece.
Many here , MANY MANY people here say they stack for a financial collapse and Greece has one:(
So my question is, how is silver and gold helping these poor sods with little access to currency?
I am sure all of you that stack for financial collapse will have some BS answer about this being different "somehow", but IT IS NOT.

Those in Greece are in the midst of a of their financial armageddon and with no access to big amounts of cash how are they going to sell their PM's?

Are they going to be bartering with PM's when food gets scarce (and it may very well do), i can not see anyone swapping PM's for their only tins of baked beans.
If stacking for "financial collapse" is actually viable then we should expect to see these PM trades in the news in the next 10 days.
I am taking the piss a tad because WE ARE NOT GOING TO SEE PM's USED IN THIS FINANCIAL collapse of Greece, just like they DID NOT in Argentina.
This IS EXACTLY the situation all those stacking for "financial collapse" would expect to be using them.
When the cash runs completely dry (or close to) and they ARE NOT using PM's will you lot stacking for this reason re-evaluate?
Because if they do not use PM's in this situation, THEN THEY NEVER WILL.
Click to expand...


As a spectator it's not easy to understand the situation in Greece or Argentina. This is not armageddon, don't get me wrong Greece is in severe financial distress but life goes on. People will still need to conduct trade and to do so they need the most liquid medium of exchange in order to satisfy basic human needs of food and shelter. The euro and argentine pesso is an easily divisible unit of account for small ticket items. Had you ever thought what if someone needs to buy and sell a car or a house? If you want to buy an apartment in Buenos Aires today you will see prices in USD. Culturally in south america its not uncommon to do deals in big ticket items with combined payment with cash and barter (yes gold) in normal economic conditions. When it comes to big ticket items people want payment in some sort of reserve asset USD or gold because it represents less risk than holding the local currency. Gold can be used for trade, because it has not been monetized to buy souvlaki does not invalidate its use.
Click to expand...
"As a spectator"?
So you are implying that YOU ONLY HAVE TO LIVE IN Greece to be an expert on the situation?
Like may be only people who have burned down their own homes should become firemen?
Like only those living in poverty should hand out financial advice?
Like only those that beat their partners should hand out advice about domestic abuse?
LOL:)
Click to expand...

dilbert.jpg

Source:
 
NO.BUT it would be nice to hear and understand their perspective of how they are dealing with it and what they would of have done differently to prepare ie would they have bought precious metals if they didn't stack...lol
 
majority of the "stackers" here only waiting for the price to go up and cash out...
 
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