Dealers - what can you report?
- Thread starter Matthew 26:14
- Start date
h dear
The website prices are about the best you can get generally. It's all well and good listing (and updating) an item at a price that can't be beat but when you can not deliver yourself then is it a fair market price?
I say no.
Therefore the only time his site should be used is right before you call him up to ask for availability, it's a website for 1 business, not the markets price check.
It seems like a dated service to me, but again, it's a service some prefer so you can't dismiss it as wrong - just different.
I say no.
Therefore the only time his site should be used is right before you call him up to ask for availability, it's a website for 1 business, not the markets price check.
It seems like a dated service to me, but again, it's a service some prefer so you can't dismiss it as wrong - just different.
Guys, W Davis is across the road from my office, and I was a customer of his before Silver Stackers was even around.
Not once has Peter failed to honour a price on his website if he has had an item on the list available. It is a reference price list for a metal trader working out of an office in Melbourne that serves walk-in customers, it's not an online store. If he has an item in stock, it's price is on the list, update throughout the day. The reverse situation would be people complaining he doesn't disclose prices and he was making them up on the spot or something if he didn't have this list.
How good is he at honouring these prices? Well I once bought some 1/10oz and 1/4oz proof Series I gold snakes off him - at his listed bullion prices. People say gold is gold. To this man it is, and it's sold as such.
Let's not forget another famous example of a price list that's not a stock list. Anyone tried to buy a platinum koala from this mob lately? I mean, they have a published price for it... (Edit - actually, they've finally taken down prices on them!)
http://www.perthmint.com.au/metalprices.aspx
Not once has Peter failed to honour a price on his website if he has had an item on the list available. It is a reference price list for a metal trader working out of an office in Melbourne that serves walk-in customers, it's not an online store. If he has an item in stock, it's price is on the list, update throughout the day. The reverse situation would be people complaining he doesn't disclose prices and he was making them up on the spot or something if he didn't have this list.
How good is he at honouring these prices? Well I once bought some 1/10oz and 1/4oz proof Series I gold snakes off him - at his listed bullion prices. People say gold is gold. To this man it is, and it's sold as such.
Let's not forget another famous example of a price list that's not a stock list. Anyone tried to buy a platinum koala from this mob lately? I mean, they have a published price for it... (Edit - actually, they've finally taken down prices on them!)
http://www.perthmint.com.au/metalprices.aspx
Alfie
Active Member
Nobody has questioned his integrity and I believe what you are saying is true
It has been clearly established that its a price list, not a stock list as you pointed out
My question is aimed specifically at:
Given these sell prices are often quoted as though they are REAL physical stock items on his site. These prices are then quoted on this forum for price comparison when in fact they are really NOTIONAL prices of items that MAY exist
So GP, is this misleading, or if its not, why not?
It has been clearly established that its a price list, not a stock list as you pointed out
My question is aimed specifically at:
Given these sell prices are often quoted as though they are REAL physical stock items on his site. These prices are then quoted on this forum for price comparison when in fact they are really NOTIONAL prices of items that MAY exist
So GP, is this misleading, or if its not, why not?
They're a good benchmark of market prices. Peter's business isn't a tinpot operation handling a few oz a week. There's nothing notional about the prices - if he's got a Swiss 20 franc, it will be the price on his website. I've got a couple of nice little Numis albums in storage with sovereign collections and USA pre-33 collections that I bought from Peter a coin at a time, at the prices he advertised on the day.
Not sure where this concept of a "notional" price comes from. If he's got it, it's the price he's advertising. I don't know how the hell you can equate clearly listed prices that many members will testify as being honoured on countless occasions as "misleading" in the slightest degree.
Not sure where this concept of a "notional" price comes from. If he's got it, it's the price he's advertising. I don't know how the hell you can equate clearly listed prices that many members will testify as being honoured on countless occasions as "misleading" in the slightest degree.
Alfie
Active Member
GP
the word Notional means "Speculative or theoretical"
Lets go through this example step by step
!) I see a sell price on his web site for a krugerrand at $1,499 as an example
2) does this coin exist?(at this stage only the price describes it), does he have it in stock, in theory one can speculate, so I ring him and no he doesn't have it in stock
GP here is the disconnect
A member looks at his webpage and assumes it exists and uses the price that describes it to assist his/her sales pitch on this forum
3) At no point CAN anyone know if he actually has the krugerrand in stock by merely looking at his web page
hence the use of the word NOTIONAL
Lets dispense with semantics
Given the information above, do you think this is misleading?
the word Notional means "Speculative or theoretical"
Lets go through this example step by step
!) I see a sell price on his web site for a krugerrand at $1,499 as an example
2) does this coin exist?(at this stage only the price describes it), does he have it in stock, in theory one can speculate, so I ring him and no he doesn't have it in stock
GP here is the disconnect
A member looks at his webpage and assumes it exists and uses the price that describes it to assist his/her sales pitch on this forum
3) At no point CAN anyone know if he actually has the krugerrand in stock by merely looking at his web page
hence the use of the word NOTIONAL
Lets dispense with semantics
Given the information above, do you think this is misleading?
Even though this is waaay OT .... Here's what I think Alfie is asking:
If W Davis has Krugerrands listed at a sale price of $1600, but he doesn't have any for sale, in fact nobody in Australia has any Krugs for sale anywhere near that price ... Then someone pops up in a forum and wants to buy Krugs, saying "looking to beat W Davis price of $1600" .... How valid is this?
I say to Alfie, however: If this practice worries you, tell the person posting in the forum: "Have you called W Davis, and do they have them in stock?"
If W Davis has Krugerrands listed at a sale price of $1600, but he doesn't have any for sale, in fact nobody in Australia has any Krugs for sale anywhere near that price ... Then someone pops up in a forum and wants to buy Krugs, saying "looking to beat W Davis price of $1600" .... How valid is this?
I say to Alfie, however: If this practice worries you, tell the person posting in the forum: "Have you called W Davis, and do they have them in stock?"
Then start another thread 
The original idea of this thread is to hear of volume of sales from bullion dealers, not arguing semantics or whether price lists are misleading.
It would be great to have informative threads of reference on bullion sales to look back on a few years times instead of well.... this....
Real information on the ground, 2011 ring a bell?
The original idea of this thread is to hear of volume of sales from bullion dealers, not arguing semantics or whether price lists are misleading.
It would be great to have informative threads of reference on bullion sales to look back on a few years times instead of well.... this....
Real information on the ground, 2011 ring a bell?
Alfie said:
The list is not created for others to base their prices on - it is a list of prices that Peter will honor.
Personally I think if you have a stock standard Krug you're doing well selling it for Peter's sell price.
If you've got something with numi premium that is a different story.
No I don't think it's misleading. It's a published price list which is honoured by the business that publishes it when there is stock to match.
If to follow the example, someone wants to get Krugerrands at a cheaper price than advertised on the W Davis website, if the market doesn't supply one, then you've got price discovery in action. I've paid more than the listed prices on there for stuff when buying elsewhere, especially some coins I chase like pre-33 $10 Eagles.
Maybe it's misleading for people to use the price list as a "must be cheaper than" reference point. That's not W Davis's fault.
Back OT, been bloody busy. Friday was quieter than Thursday. Looking forward to a heap of the yellow stuff arriving to replenish.
If to follow the example, someone wants to get Krugerrands at a cheaper price than advertised on the W Davis website, if the market doesn't supply one, then you've got price discovery in action. I've paid more than the listed prices on there for stuff when buying elsewhere, especially some coins I chase like pre-33 $10 Eagles.
Maybe it's misleading for people to use the price list as a "must be cheaper than" reference point. That's not W Davis's fault.
Back OT, been bloody busy. Friday was quieter than Thursday. Looking forward to a heap of the yellow stuff arriving to replenish.
Its the fuckin internet pal.aleks said:Then start another thread
The original idea of this thread is to hear of volume of sales from bullion dealers, not arguing semantics or whether price lists are misleading.
It would be great to have informative threads of reference on bullion sales to look back on a few years times instead of well.... this....
Real information on the ground, 2011 ring a bell?
It doesn't get rolled out on neat rolls like your ass paper.
Settle.
But that's a good line for future quoting
But that's a good line for future quoting
Alfie
Active Member
Trew said
The issue has NOTHING to do with the purpose for which list was originally created, whether Peter will honor it, and surprisingly Trew, bugger all to do with a krugerrand numi or otherwise!
It DOES have something to do with, you said it WHAT OTHER PEOPLE DO WITH THE PRICE LIST because.....drum roll
Items on the PRICE list MAY NOT EXIST, this point is important because when selling an item, say a krugerrand on this forum quoting that price, referring to something that may not exist is troublesome at least and misleading at best
I do agree with GP, this has gone off topic, I can only say I'm pleased that some of you get what I'm poorly trying to describe
Cheers
SAlfie
Don't really know how to respond to you Trew without being rude but i'll try not to
The issue has NOTHING to do with the purpose for which list was originally created, whether Peter will honor it, and surprisingly Trew, bugger all to do with a krugerrand numi or otherwise!
It DOES have something to do with, you said it WHAT OTHER PEOPLE DO WITH THE PRICE LIST because.....drum roll
Items on the PRICE list MAY NOT EXIST, this point is important because when selling an item, say a krugerrand on this forum quoting that price, referring to something that may not exist is troublesome at least and misleading at best
I do agree with GP, this has gone off topic, I can only say I'm pleased that some of you get what I'm poorly trying to describe
Cheers
SAlfie
Alfie said:
Look insult me if you have to but please EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN.
Give a scenario where somebody might lose out by referring to a price on that list.
Only one I could think of is if you are trying to sell a Krug and you want more than Peter's sell price
I can't see what is misleading in your example quoted
if a seller is willing to sell a Krug at Peter's sell price, do you think the buyer is being ripped off because Peter doesn't have one for sale ?
Alfie said:
I didn't say you insulted me - I just want to understand what everybody is going on about
The only scenario rbaggio has painted is the one I mentioned.
Somebody selling a Krug wants more than Peter's asking price and the buyer wants to pay less so points to Peter's list.
The implication here is that the seller should be able to get more if they are harder to get hold of and Peter doesn't have any.
My response is that Krugs are standard bullion coins and I still think Peter's price is valid, even if he doesn't have any.
If a seller can get Peter's sell price for a Krug they will be doing well - you won't find any dealer willing to pay that much for a Krug.
But that is just my opinion.