Crapto Collapse

JohnnyBravo300 said:
Third-party risk is any risk brought on to an organization by external parties in its ecosystem or supply chain. Such parties may include vendors, suppliers, partners, contractors, or service providers, who have access to internal company or customer data, systems, processes, or other privileged information.

Wake up man. Cryptos whether centralized or not are all third party risk. Its an easy concept to understand.
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Read the whitepaper.

Satoshi wasn't talking about a solution to third-party risk caused by computer failure, or an internet/electrical outage etc. These are real but extraneous events that can impact the ability of the bitcoin network, or any network to function in the manner in which it was developed. What did Satoshi develop? A digital payment system that enables the transfer of assets without the need for a third-party to take control of the funds.

From the Abstract:

A purely peer-to-peer version of electronic cash would allow online payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a financial institution.
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https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
 
The Bitcoin bulls promised a lot from the very beginning: P2P that's lightning-fast and anonymous, impossible to hack, bla bla bla... BUT instead now we're waking up in a financial "metaverse" CHAOS: no rules where, countless coin infrastructure components that no-one understands, updates, upgrades, scams, bankrupt projects, mega globalist companies running the show from behind, 2.0 and 3.0 and beta and gamma SCAM versions of the first edition coins, tokens, NFT's...

...no-one really understands how this entire madness works, but it sounds so nice like a Star Trek financial system. And the entire "crypto space" keep falling back.

Of course, there are so many great technical inventions among these, but a technically well-dreamed world doesn't mean it will work from the economy's point-of-view.

There are specific risks with cryptos:
1. they are being traded HEAVILY: the exchanges, the futures, crypto ETF's... - so it's a volatile Casino game, nothing better than stocks, shares,... THESE ARE NOT CURRENCIES, these are "crypto" chips, but by no means currencies
2. they are not stores of VALUE: normally, any currency must be a store of value first (but these are rather traded "assets", by a smaller extent currencies)
3. most of them are BUSINESS-run: with vested interests, cryptos are being developed, upgraded and downgraded, shut-down and re-launched (see BitTorrent NEW)
4. they depend upon 3rd PARTIES - P2P/decentralization is irrelevant: you can have a "decentralized" P2P coin, but it doesn't matter if it's being sold-off, banned, meddled-with (software), loses its reputation due to technical flaws, scams etc.

If you're not a trader, speculator, then you wouldn't want to accumulate too many of these.
The main reason why small people buy them is to HOLD ("hodl") and get rich. This is the only point of view we're looking at them.

How many people really care about how Cardano or Solana work?
Yeah, they go through the basics just to understand the key features (like what makes Doge DOGE and what makes Ethereum ETHEREUM) but people hold them hoping they will become more expensive, not because they have anything to do with "smart contracts" or other hyper-cr*p.
 
mmm....shiney! said:
Read the whitepaper.

Satoshi wasn't talking about a solution to third-party risk caused by computer failure, or an internet/electrical outage etc. These are real but extraneous events that can impact the ability of the bitcoin network, or any network to function in the manner in which it was developed. What did Satoshi develop? A digital payment system that enables the transfer of assets without the need for a third-party to take control of the funds.

From the Abstract:



https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
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You talk about it as if "Satoshi" is a real person. The name is fake and this "white paper" may as well have been written by Banksy! Opaque AF. That in itself does not instill confidence.

I agree with @treaurehunter that it is just a way to speculate and make money (or lose it) for the vast majority of us.
 
Michael Kay said:
You talk about it as if "Satoshi" is a real person. The name is fake and this "white paper" may as well have been written by Banksy!
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So what? It's a real P2P network that doesn't rely on trusted third-parties to send/receive transactions on our behalf.

Do I need to draw another picture for you?
 
mmm....shiney! said:
So what? It's a real P2P network that doesn't rely on trusted third-parties to send/receive transactions on our behalf.

Do I need to draw another picture for you?
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So what? You don't value transparency? This was one of the things that surfaced with the FTX collapse.

No more pictures, please But if you do, put a picture of a phone between the two people.
 
mmm....shiney! said:
Nice strawman.



Groan.

A phone is not a third-party.
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Don't fixate on this expression "3rd party". We all get what you are saying, but that's besides the point.

Call it what you want, but it's a necessary tool. Without it, it's like trying to change the oil in your car with no spanners or wrenches. Without it, it clearly ain't happening.

Traditional barter is the true P2P.
 
Michael Kay said:
Don't fixate on this expression "3rd party". We all get what you are saying, but that's besides the point. Call it what you want, but it's a necessary tool. Without it, it's like trying to change the oil in your car with no spanners or wrenches. Without it, it clearly ain't happening.
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Here's the definition again:

A third party is an individual or entity that is involved in a transaction but is not one of the principals and, thus, has a lesser interest in the transaction.
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Phones are not individuals. Electricity is not an entity. Neither are guns, computers, buses, spanners, wrenches or lettuce. Yet the discussion keeps being forced away from third-parties as defined in the financial sense to the concept of third-party risk or what devices we use to transact with each other. Yes we need phones or computers to carry out those transactions that's obvious. But we also use the very same tools in the traditional finance industry.

What BTC is able to achieve is

1. a network to transfer digital assets...
2. from peer-to-peer...
3. without the need for a trusted third-party to transfer the funds on our behalf.

What sets BTC apart from the traditional banking system are points 2 and 3. I keep returning to the third-party thing because it is central to defining what BTC is, yet some want to either ignore it or entirely change the definition of what constitutes a third-party in a financial transaction.

Michael Kay said:
Traditional barter is the true P2P.
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I'm so tempted to take a leaf out the playbook entitled "Redactio Absurdum" being thrown around and bang on about the tools or resources we need to produce the goods with which we can barter. But a I won't because Daisy the Jersey or Shaun the merino are not considered third-parties in a financial transaction, even though it is impossible to barter either of them if you don't have the tools to raise them or have some means to get to the market, whether it's leading Daisy with a rope by road, traveling by boat or beaming Shaun up into the USS Enterprise. So I won't.*

All I will say is that traditional barter is indeed a P2P transaction, however digital assets didn't exist when Jack traded his cow for magic beans.

*The temptation overwhelmed me and I capitulated. :D
 
Further to @jultorsk's post:

doomberg said:
the total exit value of all crypto tokens as measured in fiat is capped by the amount of fiat floating in the crypto universe.
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A picture may help explain why that comment is fallacious.

Bill the Baker has 5 loaves of bread for sale on his shop shelf. Ignoring the costs of capital goods in producing each loaf of bread (as we do with the market value of any commodity), each loaf cost him $3 in raw materials (flour, water, yeast, electricity, labour, packaging and whatever else he put in) to produce. The total amount of "fiat floating in his entire shop" represented as loaves of bread produced is therefore $15. The market value however is $20 because he is hoping to sell and make a profit of $1/loaf.

Where did this extra $5 come from? Bill didn't magically create more money. It was injected into his shop by consumers with the purchasing power required in order to satisfy their needs. And he can't realise that price until he and the seller agree on a mutually acceptable exchange. And that will only happen when the consumer takes money that was created outside of Bill's shop and brings it in to exchange for a loaf.

Screen Shot 2022-11-24 at 11.00.17 am.png
 
Michael Kay said:
So what? You don't value transparency? This was one of the things that surfaced with the FTX collapse.

No more pictures, please But if you do, put a picture of a phone between the two people.
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Not your keys, not your coins.
If you don't hold it, you don't own it.
Your argument means you don't use bank accounts because you're a creditor of a bank
 
Michael Kay said:
You talk about it as if "Satoshi" is a real person. The name is fake and this "white paper" may as well have been written by Banksy! Opaque AF. That in itself does not instill confidence.

I agree with @treaurehunter that it is just a way to speculate and make money (or lose it) for the vast majority of us.
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Clark Kent is Superman. Bruce Wayne is Batman.

Satoshi is Tyler Durden. Or Fantomas. But he might also be The Stig.
 
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The entire "crypto metaverse" is teeming with scammers and ponzi schemes.

And all those abstract twisted technical expressions used by "crypto experts" are meant to reflect incomprehensive sophistication, once in a lifetime opportunities to become a billionaire.

!!! Buy the new "CRAP COIN", better than Bitcoin, faster than Cardano and cuter than Dogecoin:

-> it's a metaversical hyperbolic interconnection between the alphanumerical blockchain of Bitcoin and the steel chain of your dog
-> it's not an NFT, coin or token, but a revolutionary 3D schizophrenic overlap of all of them!
-> fully stake-able: the digital bullshit algorithm calculates the seconds left until the next solar eclipse and multiplies it by your body temperature every hour until it finally multiplies the result by zero at midnight - to give you the sum of stake rewards earned every day
-> only works with smartwatch wallets IF you are vaccinated!
-> its matrix synchronizes with the square sex of the meta HEX
-> it shrinks the shrimp in the micro in only 2 seconds, while it also rubs the rubber chipmunk

No, you can't pay your bills with it, no you can't exchange it for fiat currency, it's not really money, not even an asset... not listed on any exchange YET. But it's gonna kill the dollar for sure!

...it's so amazing very few people know how to use it, but we'll tell you a secret: it will go ballistic!

It's 7,500 $ a piece!

Still don't want to invest?

...you don't understand the tremendous potential of CRAP COIN!

...hurry up it's halving every 2 weeks and will stop shrinking the shrimps by 2025, but will start to lobotomize its circuits once every 5 years!

...don't look at the supply, don't look at the lack of popularity, don't look at adoption, you don't understand the hyperbolic schizophrenic supersonic mechanism behind it!

...you still don't understand how amazing it is!

 
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^ that MOLVANIA Elektronik Supersonik is amazing! :D thanks for posting.

That video clip is more innovative than the entire crypto industry.
 
JohnnyBravo300 said:
You forgot to figure in maternity leave for men and optional sex change surgery coverage.
Are you even sure her name is Bill?
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Unfortunately, he never got to sell the loaves as the bakery burnt down during a mostly peaceful BLM "protest"
 
USD2.2 billion worth of BTC has been withdrawn from exchanges and sent to digital wallets for safe keeping over the past 30 days. That's a record amount. An old fashioned bank run that is pretty much near impossible with digital fiat nowadays, it's the libertarian way. Holders have voted with their feet telling the cefi industry that they have a lack of faith in their work practices. Exchanges have begun offering non-custodial wallets to their customers, here's crypto exchange Nexo's offering https://nexo.io/wallet. The benefits are yet to be seen, I've signed up for the beta testing and am waiting for more info about what that entails.


BTCUSD_2022-11-26_07-45-26.png
 
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'USD2.2 billion worth of BTC has been withdrawn from exchanges and sent to digital wallets for safe keeping over the past 30 days.'

There's a good deal of talk about this on crypto threads, shiney. Threads are quiet. Trading-volume also seems a little sluggish.
 
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