China Snakes Alive!

gerald said:
Could you elaborate on what you mean by "ungradeable condition"? I am finding that surprisingly large % of recent Chinese silver coins suffer from white spotting. I even saw a bad case on a 2012 1oz dragon flower. This is why I am hesitant to buy these coins sight unseen.

This is getting off-topic but since you mentioned it I am also looking to add the 2oz silver Wutai to my small (but growing) collection. I saw one that had damage on the reverse side, it was a small gouge in the mirrored surface. I need to visit the coin market again.
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Ungradeable meaning white spots in particular along with the normal production and handling damage that can occur such as the gouge you mention.
Collectors (normal numismatists) are a small portion of the market for MCC from what I understand. (Maybe Yennus or someone living in China could weigh in on this?) Most of the big Chinese dealers don't care about quality so much because their customers are big companies (China Mobile, Petro China, etc). They buy the coins for giving as gifts to their employees.
 
silverstar1 said:
Thanks for all the wonderful insight and posts here ! Alot of questions I have had answered here really some great info! I really did not like the colored versions at first but they have really grown on me, after reading JC888.... s post I looked at the colored ox and I think that one especially is really a nice design, I am not sure what the coloring agent used is but it seems to be a much higher quality, almost like an enamel, compared to many of the other cheap looking colored printed paint from some other mints I have seen.I like the plain silver and gold the best still, Really beautiful coins! The Tiger and Dragon are my favorites at the moment but they are all very nice.

I agree Catseye its almost blasphemy to compare ASEs to these , I was just using an example that maybe they could make a cheaper bullion round or something at pricing similar to the pandas and sold in sheets so we could stack the hell out of them but yes a pretty bad comparison , please forgive me... LOL
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If they started producing your cheaper bullion pieces they would be no different than ASE's and not worth collecting or stacking in my opinion.
I collect the nicest coins (pieces of art), I stack the cheapest generic bars. I see no utility for much in the middle unless you are a dealer who is in it to flip metals regardless of the price.
 
I love these chinese lunars - stunning coins.

I have the silver flower dragon, rabbit and tiger, want to get the ox but very hard to find - saw them last year at $500+, wish I had got one then but thought it was overpriced - silly me! :o

Will get the snake, but am concerned that the main dealers on ebay and USA (got my last ones from HUAYIN SHOUCANG) are now cherry picking the good ones to get graded and leave the 2nd's for me! I don't want a graded coin but still want a good quality coin.

Where is my best bet to get a good, non-graded silver 1oz flower snake?
 
I don't think Xu Hong (HUANYIN) grades a lot of coins. In general the coins I bought off him have not got visible defects but then again I have not graded anything I bought from him.

I've also been fine visually with coins from PandaAmerica although once again I have not graded anything.

I only have the dragon plum blossom, not sure I want to finish the set but this is tempting... I think this calls for a group buy? :P

Most of the big Chinese dealers don't care about quality so much because their customers are big companies (China Mobile, Petro China, etc). They buy the coins for giving as gifts to their employees.
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Sounds like I need a new job ;)
 
AndyRoo68 said:
I love these chinese lunars - stunning coins.

I have the silver flower dragon, rabbit and tiger, want to get the ox but very hard to find - saw them last year at $500+, wish I had got one then but thought it was overpriced - silly me! :o

Will get the snake, but am concerned that the main dealers on ebay and USA (got my last ones from HUAYIN SHOUCANG) are now cherry picking the good ones to get graded and leave the 2nd's for me! I don't want a graded coin but still want a good quality coin.

Where is my best bet to get a good, non-graded silver 1oz flower snake?
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Thincat00 on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/160925967815
 
Catseye said:
AndyRoo68 said:
I love these chinese lunars - stunning coins.

I have the silver flower dragon, rabbit and tiger, want to get the ox but very hard to find - saw them last year at $500+, wish I had got one then but thought it was overpriced - silly me! :o

Will get the snake, but am concerned that the main dealers on ebay and USA (got my last ones from HUAYIN SHOUCANG) are now cherry picking the good ones to get graded and leave the 2nd's for me! I don't want a graded coin but still want a good quality coin.

Where is my best bet to get a good, non-graded silver 1oz flower snake?
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Thincat00 on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/160925967815
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I agree +1 good dealer, I have bought from him in the past ,if you want an ungraded real nice one he is reputable , a piece of advise for whatever its worth, I bought a few lunars from thincat,for my daughters collection to fill in some holes ,he quoted me a price ,I accepted it and asked him to pick me out the best coins ,I am extremely happy they are at least 69 and maybe 70(sending them soon) moral of the story :) I wanted the best coins and did not squeeze him for a few dollars and he gave me what I wanted ,just some advise:) if your buying 50 haggle ,1 for your collection ,pay a little extra and expect the best:) feel free to mention my name(Joe from Virginia)regard,s.......... thin cat has the flower ox you might be able to buy it in the 500 range.
 
silverstar1 said:
I really did not like the colored versions at first but they have really grown on me, after reading JC888.... s post I looked at the colored ox and I think that one especially is really a nice design, I am not sure what the coloring agent used is but it seems to be a much higher quality, almost like an enamel, compared to many of the other cheap looking colored printed paint from some other mints I have seen.I like the plain silver and gold the best still, Really beautiful coins! The Tiger and Dragon are my favorites at the moment but they are all very nice.
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The colored coins are growing on me as well. Thanks for your comments regarding the quality of the paint job (for lack of a better term), I've never looked at them that closely.

The early Chinese colored lunars look really "low budget" to me, mind you this is only judging by the photos I've seen online.
 
Catseye said:
Ungradeable meaning white spots in particular along with the normal production and handling damage that can occur such as the gouge you mention.
Collectors (normal numismatists) are a small portion of the market for MCC from what I understand. (Maybe Yennus or someone living in China could weigh in on this?) Most of the big Chinese dealers don't care about quality so much because their customers are big companies (China Mobile, Petro China, etc). They buy the coins for giving as gifts to their employees.
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I think you are right in that the bulk of these coins are going to non-collectors. Brib... oops I meant gift-giving is very big here.
 
jc888888888 said:
Catseye said:
AndyRoo68 said:
I love these chinese lunars - stunning coins.

I have the silver flower dragon, rabbit and tiger, want to get the ox but very hard to find - saw them last year at $500+, wish I had got one then but thought it was overpriced - silly me! :o

Will get the snake, but am concerned that the main dealers on ebay and USA (got my last ones from HUAYIN SHOUCANG) are now cherry picking the good ones to get graded and leave the 2nd's for me! I don't want a graded coin but still want a good quality coin.

Where is my best bet to get a good, non-graded silver 1oz flower snake?
Click to expand...

Thincat00 on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/160925967815
Click to expand...

I agree +1 good dealer, I have bought from him in the past ,if you want an ungraded real nice one he is reputable , a piece of advise for whatever its worth, I bought a few lunars from thincat,for my daughters collection to fill in some holes ,he quoted me a price ,I accepted it and asked him to pick me out the best coins ,I am extremely happy they are at least 69 and maybe 70(sending them soon) moral of the story :) I wanted the best coins and did not squeeze him for a few dollars and he gave me what I wanted ,just some advise:) if your buying 50 haggle ,1 for your collection ,pay a little extra and expect the best:) feel free to mention my name(Joe from Virginia)regard,s.......... thin cat has the flower ox you might be able to buy it in the 500 range.
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+11111... Thincat is a Top Notch Source..
Joe has some very good advise here, and holds true with this seller and others...

At some point you have to choose, Hagal for the last penny or politely ask for the best coin ...
 
+1 thincat, bought BOC 100th Anniv pandas from him and they were excellent.

He actually speaks English to a certain degree too so not bad at all.
 
AndyRoo68 said:
Will get the snake, but am concerned that the main dealers on ebay and USA (got my last ones from HUAYIN SHOUCANG) are now cherry picking the good ones to get graded and leave the 2nd's for me! I don't want a graded coin but still want a good quality coin.

Where is my best bet to get a good, non-graded silver 1oz flower snake?
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I too have suspected that's what many dealers in the US are doing. That said, I doubt many dealers in China are going to the trouble as from what I can tell graded coins are not very popular here (yet). It's also not practical for dealers here to get their coins graded, as there is potential risk with customs duties when the coins come back. But I'm a newb at all this so I could be wrong.

As for how to get a good, raw coin, perhaps some of the regulars here that are based in China will have a few for sale. If not, I may be able to help but I have to visit the coin market first as I don't know what the snakes are selling for there.
 
jc888888888 said:
I would love to hear the prices of the new snakes in the Beijing market!!
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Hi jc, I will try to get to the coin market next week (I have been slacking off at work this week).
 
Hey guys I've been collecting 1oz and 1/2oz pandas. Would it be a good idea to get this lunar snake? It'll be my first lunar coin.

It'll be for collecting cum investing.

Opinions would be much appreciated.

Thanks.
 
silverstar1 said:
picturefun said:
PandaAmerica.com sure gets a lot of cream from being the only official dealer for PRC Mint in the U.S. Just look at their Brand New nice looking office Building they just built last year in CA.
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Yeah but PA and Chinese , Australian , German ect. dealers all have similar prices , there has to be a place climbing up the chain where it stops at that price.
For example a bullion American silver eagle is about say $2-$3 over spot and the proof version in box , COA is maybe $15 -$20 over spot , Although not a very interesting coin in my opinion.
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American silver eagle has the SAME design, year after year, so boring, and have NO mintage limitation.

So you cannot compare it with Panda, which has an unique design each year, and a VERY LIMITED mintage up until two years ago. And even if these two years, it still have a limit of 6-8 million, unlike ASE that have no limit.

Not to mention, there are much more panda fans on this planet than American eagle fans :D

That is why Panda coin has a high premium.
 
smokymcpot said:
Hey guys I've been collecting 1oz and 1/2oz pandas. Would it be a good idea to get this lunar snake? It'll be my first lunar coin.

It'll be for collecting cum investing.

Opinions would be much appreciated.

Thanks.
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Lunar coins have to be in a set. It is probably too expensive to buy those from previous years.

Panda coins are different. Very few people have the whole set, because earlier years of panda coins are so rare. you can just buy one whenever you see a good deal.

Moderncoinmart had a good black friday sale with free shipping to the U.S., but now the sale is over. Maybe they will have a sale before Xmas too. who knows?
 
The china silver scallop lunars are easily one of my favorite series. Kudos to China Mint's minting technology for minting such intricate details on their lunar coins, especially the eyes of the lunars. :)

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