Bailout of Cyprus to cost depositors 10% immediately

[AngloSaxon]

The SBS news just said that Cypriots who lose money will be compensated by shares in the banks they hold the accounts in to equal value of the funds they lose.

Which sounds good on the face of it but doesn't this just dilute the equity in all those banks? It's conceivable that more shares could be issued for a given bank than currently exist. If that happened to anything I was invested in and my share of dividend was diluted by over 100% I'd be furious.

And you can kiss any capital growth in those bank funds goodbye.

AND the people who are issued shares are most likely mostly 1st time or completely novice investors who will not know how to properly manage their press gang 'investment'. And they will most likely face capital gains tax anyway! If they don't its because the divident liquidity issue has driven the price down on their shares.

Everybody loses.

 

[finchy]

^ Outright theft,i just saw that mentioned on sbs regarding the bank reimbursing clients money with shares,what a joke ...
Thats the equivalent of getting upgraded to a ocean view cabin on the titanic just before it goes down,what a slap in the face.

 

[Emanance]

Made me think of...
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TlPo0yCSa4[/youtube]

 

[Clawhammer]

If I was a Cypriot... I'd be out in the street smashing windows and setting fire to every bank and government building I could find. And low betide any police, security guards or do-gooders that stood in the way.

This'll cost them more than just 10% of their savings or their political positions...

oh dear.

It's already started...on tonite's ABC news was a shot of a front-end loader someone had driven into a bank....

 

[systematic]

The money in a savings account isnt really there. Its a statement of the bank's debt to the customer. The bank now owes them 10% less. How is that for irony?

 

[nickybaby]

If I was a Cypriot... I'd be out in the street smashing windows and setting fire to every bank and government building I could find. And low betide any police, security guards or do-gooders that stood in the way.

This'll cost them more than just 10% of their savings or their political positions...

oh dear.

It's already started...on tonite's ABC news was a shot of a front-end loader someone had driven into a bank....

Must be watching different news feeds. The one I saw had him parked outside the bank mouthing off to the police.

Quite a different protest to your violent views of smashing any bank/government building and taking anybody down who gets in the way of your illegal and pathetic intended actions.

 

[Clawhammer]

^^^
Nice to know you'll do what you're told while being robbed

 

[Clawhammer]

Ohh come-on Nickybaby.. I haven't even started on about WA's getting shafted over the GST yet

 

[southerncross]

oh dear.

It's already started...on tonite's ABC news was a shot of a front-end loader someone had driven into a bank....

Must be watching different news feeds. The one I saw had him parked outside the bank mouthing off to the police.

Quite a different protest to your violent views of smashing any bank/government building and taking anybody down who gets in the way of your illegal and pathetic intended actions.

MMMM lets see here,

People who have saved for the future getting sodomised by institutions and autocrats for the sake of propping up a doomed currency and being stolen from with no avenue of recourse IE illegal and pathetic intended actions.....

Or people saying enough of being sodomised by institutions and autocrats, I/We will no longer tolerate being treated in this manner by you and will take action as we feel suitable. If you intend to rob us in order to satiate your own needs we will respond.

I think you might have a whole different take on things if it was your personal property and cash that was being taken from you by force with no warning and by deceptive means, It might not seem so much from a distance but what if that 10% was the difference between success and failure ? Being able to pay the next mortgage payment or losing your house, receiving an interest payment as a pensioner that allowed you to survive or not ?

I don't think you really get it at all.

 

[nickybaby]

It's already started...on tonite's ABC news was a shot of a front-end loader someone had driven into a bank....

Must be watching different news feeds. The one I saw had him parked outside the bank mouthing off to the police.

Quite a different protest to your violent views of smashing any bank/government building and taking anybody down who gets in the way of your illegal and pathetic intended actions.

MMMM lets see here,

People who have saved for the future getting sodomised by institutions and autocrats for the sake of propping up a doomed currency and being stolen from with no avenue of recourse IE illegal and pathetic intended actions.....

Or people saying enough of being sodomised by institutions and autocrats, I/We will no longer tolerate being treated in this manner by you and will take action as we feel suitable. If you intend to rob us in order to satiate your own needs we will respond.

I think you might have a whole different take on things if it was your personal property and cash that was being taken from you by force with no warning and by deceptive means, It might not seem so much from a distance but what if that 10% was the difference between success and failure ? Being able to pay the next mortgage payment or losing your house, receiving an interest payment as a pensioner that allowed you to survive or not ?

I don't think you really get it at all.

Please clarify how is setting fire to a building and taking anybody who gets in the way preventing theft?

Please do not mistake separate arguments.

I am arguing about the post that states it is ok to go and burn stuff down. How is this preventing anything excetp to fuel your pathetic need for violence?

The original post was about smashing and burning any bank building and any government building? ergo he will go and smash bridges, train stations ect! if this was in Australia would it be ok to go and burn down the opera house or Freemantle port?

Please do not mistake general thuggish violence as preventing anything. Yes people should stand up for them selves, but there is a difference between standing up for yourself and thuggish pathetic mob mentality.

The second post said that the front end loader had been driven into the front of the bank. Looks parked up outside the bank to me. Yes it is close to the bank but doesn't appear to be in the bank to me. But then again why let accuracy get in the way of a good story!!

 

[trew]

This whole thing is no different to the total corruption that went on with TARP etc. in the US.
It is totally corrupt for the depositors to lose money but not the shareholders!

A banking crisis should be handled the way Sweden handled it in the 1990s.
1. Any banks that cannot continue get nationalized.
2. All existing shareholders get wiped out - totally - no arguments.
3. Govt puts in new capital to re-capitalize and keep things running.

If public money is used to save a bank then the public should damn well end up owning the bank!


I suspect this is all being done to avoid other European banks having to recognize losses on their loans to Cyprian banks.
Once that happens there will be a domino effect that would pretty much send almost every bank in Europe into bankruptcy.
Same as all the tricks pulled with Greece's sovereign debts - anything to avoid German and French banks having to recognize what they have already lost.

 

[systematic]

The second post said that the front end loader had been driven into the front of the bank. Looks parked up outside the bank to me. Yes it is close to the bank but doesn't appear to be in the bank to me.

Its all relative. Its been thousands of years and the Parthenon still hasnt been finished.

 

[wrcmad]

A banking crisis should be handled the way Sweden handled it in the 1990s.
1. Any banks that cannot continue get nationalized.
2. All existing shareholders get wiped out - totally - no arguments.
3. Govt puts in new capital to re-capitalize and keep things running.

If public money is used to save a bank then the public should damn well end up owning the bank!

100% agree. Since when do unsecuritised shareholders get preference over depositors? The mind boggles....

 

[AngloSaxon]

This whole thing is no different to the total corruption that went on with TARP etc. in the US.
It is totally corrupt for the depositors to lose money but not the shareholders!

The shareholders are losing out on this just as much as depositors. Their investment is going to be diluted to an unknown amount, the share price of every bank in Cyprus is about to crash and who is going to want to buy those shares now?

As I said earlier on this subject: Everybody loses.

 

[southerncross]

Must be watching different news feeds. The one I saw had him parked outside the bank mouthing off to the police.

Quite a different protest to your violent views of smashing any bank/government building and taking anybody down who gets in the way of your illegal and pathetic intended actions.

MMMM lets see here,

People who have saved for the future getting sodomised by institutions and autocrats for the sake of propping up a doomed currency and being stolen from with no avenue of recourse IE illegal and pathetic intended actions.....

Or people saying enough of being sodomised by institutions and autocrats, I/We will no longer tolerate being treated in this manner by you and will take action as we feel suitable. If you intend to rob us in order to satiate your own needs we will respond.

I think you might have a whole different take on things if it was your personal property and cash that was being taken from you by force with no warning and by deceptive means, It might not seem so much from a distance but what if that 10% was the difference between success and failure ? Being able to pay the next mortgage payment or losing your house, receiving an interest payment as a pensioner that allowed you to survive or not ?

I don't think you really get it at all.

Please clarify how is setting fire to a building and taking anybody who gets in the way preventing theft?

Please do not mistake separate arguments.

I am arguing about the post that states it is ok to go and burn stuff down. How is this preventing anything excetp to fuel your pathetic need for violence?

The original post was about smashing and burning any bank building and any government building? ergo he will go and smash bridges, train stations ect! if this was in Australia would it be ok to go and burn down the opera house or Freemantle port?

Please do not mistake general thuggish violence as preventing anything. Yes people should stand up for them selves, but there is a difference between standing up for yourself and thuggish pathetic mob mentality.

The second post said that the front end loader had been driven into the front of the bank. Looks parked up outside the bank to me. Yes it is close to the bank but doesn't appear to be in the bank to me. But then again why let accuracy get in the way of a good story!!

So what would you do if I came and took 10% of your savings, Write me a nasty letter ? Let me guess, call the Cops ? The difference here is that it is the system that is doing the thieving with no recourse within the law. Thuggish pathetic mob mentality ? What do you call the orchestrated theft from millions of people in order to prop up the banking cartels of the west ?

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants". Thomas Jefferson

 

[Emanance]

I suppose it's not such a big deal when you consider that in reality we are 'all' being taken down for around 10% of the buying power of our fiat currencies year after year courtesy of our own central banks money printing. And when the current rounds of currency 'creation' hit the real economy we could expect that to only increase. Still, I have to feel sorry for the Cypriots having to cope with this double dose of government sanctioned theft.

Source:http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/inflation-charts

 

[willrocks]

Let the Youtube ranting begin:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDXtHsz2q6Q[/youtube]

 

[trew]

That guy is a loon but did make one good point early in his rant:

Results of the 2011 EU-wide stress testing exercise

Bank of Cyprus successfully passed the stress test exercise

The results reaffirm the solid financial fundamentals of the Bank
which by maintaining adequate capital ratios, strong liquidity and
profitability successfully faces even the adverse stress scenarios

July 2011

source: http://www.bankofcyprus.com/Documen... Stress Tests/ENG/StressTestsENG combined.pdf


Fat lot of use that was.

 

[Ag47]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/03/01/cyprus-bailout-idUSL6N0BTAAR20130301

1 March 2013

"(Reuters) - Cyprus's new finance minister on Friday ruled out a haircut, or imposed losses, on bank deposits to ease a financial bailout from international lenders, now stalled amid worries about debt sustainability.

"Really and categorically - and this doesn't only apply in the case of Cyprus but for the world over and the euro zone - there really couldn't be a more stupid idea," Michael Sarris, who took over his post on Friday, told reporters.

Sarris, a widely respected economist, was the first appointment of new Cypriot President Nicos Anastasiades, who won presidential elections on Feb. 24 on a platform of constructively attempting to seek a deal with lenders."

 

[FullMetalFever]

MMMM lets see here,

People who have saved for the future getting sodomised by institutions and autocrats for the sake of propping up a doomed currency and being stolen from with no avenue of recourse IE illegal and pathetic intended actions.....

Or people saying enough of being sodomised by institutions and autocrats, I/We will no longer tolerate being treated in this manner by you and will take action as we feel suitable. If you intend to rob us in order to satiate your own needs we will respond.

I think you might have a whole different take on things if it was your personal property and cash that was being taken from you by force with no warning and by deceptive means, It might not seem so much from a distance but what if that 10% was the difference between success and failure ? Being able to pay the next mortgage payment or losing your house, receiving an interest payment as a pensioner that allowed you to survive or not ?

I don't think you really get it at all.

Please clarify how is setting fire to a building and taking anybody who gets in the way preventing theft?

Please do not mistake separate arguments.

I am arguing about the post that states it is ok to go and burn stuff down. How is this preventing anything excetp to fuel your pathetic need for violence?

The original post was about smashing and burning any bank building and any government building? ergo he will go and smash bridges, train stations ect! if this was in Australia would it be ok to go and burn down the opera house or Freemantle port?

Please do not mistake general thuggish violence as preventing anything. Yes people should stand up for them selves, but there is a difference between standing up for yourself and thuggish pathetic mob mentality.

The second post said that the front end loader had been driven into the front of the bank. Looks parked up outside the bank to me. Yes it is close to the bank but doesn't appear to be in the bank to me. But then again why let accuracy get in the way of a good story!!

So what would you do if I came and took 10% of your savings, Write me a nasty letter ? Let me guess, call the Cops ? The difference here is that it is the system that is doing the thieving with no recourse within the law. Thuggish pathetic mob mentality ? What do you call the orchestrated theft from millions of people in order to prop up the banking cartels of the west ?

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants". Thomas Jefferson

I have little faith that people in most Western countries would take any meaningful action, whether it be 10%, 20% or 50% of their savings that are stolen. Particularly true for Australia where we just seem to bend over and take it ... and say thanks afterwards.

Try doing that in the Middle East or South America and see what happens. Hopefuly the Cypriots still have enough fire in their blood to let their opposition to these measures be known and not simply read the presidents statement (as posted earlier) and say "fair enough".