Another round of smackdown is ahead for Gold and Silver
- Thread starter leon1998
- Start date
Gatito Bandito
Active Member
leon1998 said:When Silver price was dropping in the past few years, people kept buying, disregarding the chart and touting the fundamental. Now Silver has been rising, all of a sudden people start to believe in charts.
How ironic
And these are the same exact people?
Amazing! Simply amazing!!
Oh, wait..
tiddleyetom said:
It could be the handle, I'm not sure it's finished yet personally. That's the only thing I don't like about this particular situation. The cup depth isn't 33% it's closer to 18%. If it were to work out then this handle might be very short and the gains only 10% or so from the handle's lows. It's all real easy to see after it's formed completely but then you missed it.
Jim4silver
Well-Known Member
leon1998 said:When Silver price was dropping in the past few years, people kept buying, disregarding the chart and touting the fundamental. Now Silver has been rising, all of a sudden people start to believe in charts.
How ironic
I used to be that type of silver bull that didn't want to hear anything "negative" about silver. There are many silver bulls like that today. Usually it is people somewhat new to metals whose eyes are opened all the sudden to the shenanigans in the financial world. Unfortunately the info these silver bulls get comes from the same 5 or 6 PM bull sites that use the same handful of pundits who have been wrong for the past 4 years but for some reason keep coming out with new predictions of markets crashing in the near or immediate future, etc. (I think there are some big crashes coming, but impossible to say when).
I even used to think anyone on a PM site who said metals would drop was automatically a shill or troll, and many PM bulls still feel that way, even some here probably.
Just my opinion.
Jim
Caneorange
Member
What are swap dealers?
Given that metal swaps are transactions in physical, and the dealers only use the futures market to hedge themselves as counterparty, I don't know where all the excitement and gnashing of teeth regarding "gangsters" comes from?Skyrocket said:leon1998 said:...this is about US$1.95B bet Banksters are making against silver.
Gangsters :|
Maybe either of you could explain?
wrcmad said:Given that metal swaps are transactions in physical, and the dealers only use the futures market to hedge themselves as counterparty, I don't know where all the excitement and gnashing of teeth regarding "gangsters" comes from?Skyrocket said:leon1998 said:...this is about US$1.95B bet Banksters are making against silver.
Gangsters :|
Maybe either of you could explain?
The old saying about what is the bigger crime "to rob a bank or to own a bank".
They're all crooks imo :|
tiddleyetom
Member
theFNG said:
So going from the image in willrocks post above, we are very likely at point 5
Or we will drop off a cliff back into the A$1600s coz the cup isnt big enough
Roll on Monday
Aaaahhh, the ol' self-confirmation-bias perma-rhetoric.... got it.Skyrocket said:wrcmad said:Given that metal swaps are transactions in physical, and the dealers only use the futures market to hedge themselves as counterparty, I don't know where all the excitement and gnashing of teeth regarding "gangsters" comes from?Skyrocket said:
Maybe either of you could explain?
The old saying about what is the bigger crime "to rob a bank or to own a bank".
They're all crooks imo :|
"We suspect that shorting gold has come to seem like a riskless proposition as long as there is confidence in the Fed. Synthetic gold is the perfect substance for a carry trade: an easy borrow with very low carrying cost and little upside basis risk. Such a hypothesis, in our opinion, does much to explain the incongruity of a declining gold price while fundamentals for paper currency, and the U.S. dollar in particular, obviously deteriorate; while demand for physical gold has exceeded new mine supply for several years running; and while above-ground 400-ounce .995-gold bars located in London, New York, and other financial capitals (in cohabitation with speculative trading activity in paper markets) have steadily dwindled and disappeared into Asian financial centers reformulated as .9999 kilo bars."
Tocqueville Gold Newsletter 2Q 2015
Tocqueville Gold Newsletter 2Q 2015
Gatito Bandito
Active Member
SilverPete said:
Hey, if we get enough traders to play along, this just might work!
Caneorange
Member
Read that on google already. What does that mean?wrcmad said:
Caneorange said:
Well, maybe your fingers are broken? I'll assist with the rest of your google search:
Gold swaps are usually the simultaneous spot sale of gold with a forward transaction to buy the same amount back at a later date. For governments and central banks it has become a way either of raising cash to meet short contingencies or simply to invest the money on an interest-bearing basis. The gold itself has become an important source of liquidity to the market. The swap technique has been used in particular by gold mining producers - instead of selling the gold outright they can swap it to provide immediate liquidity. Gold swaps are where the gold lender pays the borrower a rate of interest. Because storing physical bullion safely isn't cost-free (even if it is very cheap). Gold owners also miss out on the interest rate which holding cash instead would provide.
So if you want someone to swap your gold for its cash value today, and swap back sometime in the future, they will then bear two costs storage fees and lost interest in the meantime. So they might reasonably expect you to pay them to take it away.
This is not gold leasing. In gold leasing there is a lender and a borrower of metal, and the borrower pays the lender a rate of interest. It's always positive to the lender, because it's an unsecured loan. So the rate of interest depends on the borrower's credit-worthiness.
The Swap dealer is the entity that deals primarily in swaps for a commodity and who acts as the counterparty in a swap agreement for a fee called a spread. Swap dealers are the market makers for the swap market, and use the futures markets to manage or hedge the risk associated with those swaps transactions.
The swap dealer's counter parties may be speculative traders, like hedge funds, or traditional commercial clients that are managing risk arising from their dealings in the physical commodity. It's worth noting that the bulk of their positions are passively managed and passively managed generally also means non-leveraged. The Swap dealers are also not making a one-way bet using futures, but instead use futures to hedge their swaps.
If a Swap Dealer is using short futures to hedge, then the dealer has a long position on the other side. How does the Swaps Dealer get a long position? He has a client who wants a short position via swap. The client goes short on swap vs the Swap dealer who goes long on swap. That's the first trade. The next trade, the hedge, is for the Swap dealer to hedge his risk on the COMEX (or elsewhere) by getting short exposure.
Jim4silver
Well-Known Member
Since we're on the subject of silver charts, it looks to me like it might be a recent head and shoulders forming which is normally bearish.
http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=$SILVER
Jim
http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=$SILVER
Jim
Swap dealers/Banks have been trying very hard to smack down gold & silver prices, in the last two days. However, it seems more and more money flows into gold ETF (GLD) recently. Take one example, although GLD is down -1.78%, the fund has a net purchase of 20 tons in one day! This is the most since 2011.
So the fight between Banks and Large Speculators is ON, but who will win?
So the fight between Banks and Large Speculators is ON, but who will win?
Gold pennant looking bullish, with stocks teetering, I know where I have my money
leon1998 said:Swap dealers/Banks have been trying very hard to smack down gold & silver prices, in the last two days. However, it seems more and more money flows into gold ETF (GLD) recently. Take one example, although GLD is down -1.78%, the fund has a net purchase of 20 tons in one day! This is the most since 2011.
So the fight between Banks and Large Speculators is ON, but who will win?
There does seem to be quite a battle going on... I have to admit, I want it to go down! I need more time to buy!