Another attack on SMSF's

[Elemental]

A SMSF is itself trust. When you establish a SMSF you are setting up a trust and the trust must have a trustee. It is possible and a good idea to have a company acting as trustee of the SMSF. The company directors will be members of the fund.

Then who are the beneficaries of a corporate SMSF? Are you saying its a corporate body? I'm all for SMSF's, please don't get me wrong, but in this fashion its plainly tax avoidance & in fairness to the average punter it goes outside it's original intention to provide for individuals in their retirement. Clearly, these funds are screwing the whole system up for the average self funded retiree?

I think you are getting confused here.

To complete this process end to end, for a couple, I would establish a new company (ABC Pty Ltd). This company would actually be set up as a special purpose SMSF company (lower ASIC fees). The company itself actually doesn't trade, or do anything at all except act as the trustee for the SMSF. The two directors ABC Pty Ltd would be the couple who want to set up an SMSF. The 'beneficiaries' (really an incorrect term as companies have shareholders, not beneficiaries) so the shareholders would be the couple who want to set up the SMSF. Please note that there would never be dividends paid on these shares and there would never be any trading in this company.

Once the company is established (you actually do it at the same time) you would then establish the SMSF - call it ABC Super Fund. This invloves setting up a trust. As I said before, the trust must have a trustee (the trustee acts for the trust, and makes all the decisions on behalf of the trust and must act for the benefit of the beneficiaries of the trust - in this case, the couple setting up the SMSF). ABC Super Fund (trust) could have individuals (the aforementioned couple) act as trustee or it can have a corporate trustee (ABC Pty Ltd).

The SMSF or 'trust' acts and is taxed in the same way regardless of who is acting as trustee (individuals or the corporate trustee). There is no differnence in that regard (small disclaimer - having a corporate trustee allows greater flexibility in terms of paying lump sums, which is why I said you would usually use a corporate trustee).

Many of my clients are looking towards setting up their own SMSF and I usually say 'I'm not allowed, by law, to give that advise. All I can say is that I have an SMSF and most people I know also do. I can also advise of the best way to set this up and the costs involoved. How you invest the money in that SMSF - if you decide to go ahead - is up to you".

Cheers

 

[Dynoman]

Then who are the beneficaries of a corporate SMSF? Are you saying its a corporate body? I'm all for SMSF's, please don't get me wrong, but in this fashion its plainly tax avoidance & in fairness to the average punter it goes outside it's original intention to provide for individuals in their retirement. Clearly, these funds are screwing the whole system up for the average self funded retiree?

There we go again that bloody aweful word average. Do you really aspire to being an "average" loser ?

The only screwing occuring is our Pollies who are on a defined benefit gold mine funded by you and I and the unelected swill in the government departments who are sqeezing honest law abdiding tax payers who just want life for their kids to be better.

It is time we made them accountable. Try running a small business

Kind Regards
non recourse

You say average loser? I meant to describe the average person trying to make better for themselves & to differeniate between fairness & corporate greed.

I've stacked PM's for a few years now & encourage others too, despite ridicule from many of my colleagues, so there's no way I'd describe myself as average. Except maybe, an average stacker

 

[nonrecourse]

yeh you're lucky. for those of us who are still 3 decades or more away from retirement - the government will keep f.n.g with the taxation/rules of sMSF until there is nothing left of it!

I know i wont see 1 cent of my SMSF

Yippe I'm surprised at your defeatest attitude with your super. Why not set up an SMSF and take control? Having said that you need two other structures outside of super as you well know.

Your a smart man with your clay feet like mine on the ground. Don't get despondent, get angry you know enough about how the system works. Use it to your advantage. Gold and silver bullion on its own just doesn't cut it.

Kind Regards
non recourse

 

[nonrecourse]

[You say average loser? I meant to describe the average person trying to make better for themselves & to differeniate between fairness & corporate greed.

I've stacked PM's for a few years now & encourage others too, despite ridicule from many of my colleagues, so there's no way I'd describe myself as average. Except maybe, an average stacker

Sorry my mantra is anyone who is average is bloody awful its not really having a go at you. You are being sucked in if you listen to the lets be fair mob. You never solve a poor mans problem by trying to impoverish the high achievers.

I don't disagree that there are lots of crooks in business but I would argue as a percentage there are a lot more "average" punters who sit on thir backside saying they don't mind paying a bit more tax of course they don't mind they pay sweet f. a.

This thread is about super and not having to depend on the government. I want nothing from those lying bastards because I know they can't deliver and I want to continue to control my destiny and so should you.

Kind Regards
non recourse

 

[ShinyStuff]

yeh you're lucky. for those of us who are still 3 decades or more away from retirement - the government will keep f.n.g with the taxation/rules of sMSF until there is nothing left of it!

I know i wont see 1 cent of my SMSF

Yippe I'm surprised at your defeatest attitude with your super. Why not set up an SMSF and take control? Having said that you need two other structures outside of super as you well know.

Your a smart man with your clay feet like mine on the ground. Don't get despondent, get angry you know enough about how the system works. Use it to your advantage. Gold and silver bullion on its own just doesn't cut it.

Kind Regards
non recourse

NR,
I sort of know how Yip feels. While I know you are a believe of three or four pillars to establish your financial security... but seriously not everyone has the ability (IQ), agility (emotional intelliegence and know how) to negotiate the traps or the time (I work and raise a large family on a small income - wage slave).

To say set up a small business and family trusts etc to funnel money through, to pay yourself first, then the ATO etc etc is all well and good if you have the knowledge and ability to take these risks.

I am not having a pity party. I would love to succeed at all of this stuff, but I have failed at two small businesses (I dont have the smarts.. while I have an average IQ), and sadly my parents failed at their three small businesses they tried over their 30 years. So,it is pretty funny. I do look at the bright side... but some people have success on their side!! I am always one of those... "XXX% of small businesses fail in the first year" sort of people!! Ha!

So, I do what I can. I have a SMSF. This is all I can do now, while trying to get ahead with IPs and the odd bit of education. Right now I am spending all my spare time reading and trying to fix my poor business skills up! Heaven knows they need fixing!!!

Shiny.

 

[nonrecourse]

Shiney Stuff Very few individuals succeed first or even second go in a business. You learn a lot more from your failures than from success. Success can breed contempt and complacency if it happens too soon. Failure is part of being successful so it is counterintuitive.

Its the law of averages. Thats why I hate the term average. Aspiring to be average means you have not really comitted to being out there at the edge of the Bell curve.

Being finacially literate takes a lifetime of commitment. Just when you think you have a handle on it you learn a little bit more that shows you that you have a lot more to learn.

You should never be ashamed because you tried and failed. Being a good business man has very little to do with intelligence. Kerry Packer was the village idiot at Geelong Grammar. Being a good business man or woman is more about using your common sense and your strengths to build something that is a fit for you.

We all have special abilities you just have to figure out where yours are.

Kind Regards
non recourse

 

[Clawhammer]

Another article on labors super plan.... one might suspect there are a few journalists with a SMSF what with all the coverage this is getting;

http://www.bigpondmoney.com.au/self-managed-super-storm-brews?ref=SCM-news-super-storm