2012 Perth Mint High Relief Dragon sold for less than issue price.

that's pretty darn rare. The low end ive been seeing on ebay is 130. Previous completed listing sorted by most recent for ungraded coins:

134
141
154
156
150
185
175
153

All those within the last 2-3 days. And none of those prices include the shipping charges added(none were free shipping)
 
Cost of getting one from the PM shipped was about AUD $135.00

With paypal/ebay fees those prices make it a money loser.
 
They will go down like the titanic.. steedy she blows... IMO 2012 is the year for Physical Silver over-supply.. its like the mints in the world got mega busy for the year of the Dragon.. this oversupply will be a massive stress test for bullion and premium product's ability to stay above issue price..

My prediction is 75% of all dragon coins will having shrinking premiums and will battle to stay afloat.. for non-dragon items its not looking much better...

Sir, the possibility of another red-back spider (like) PM issue are approximately three thousand, seven hundred and eighteen to one! (very similar to the chances of successfully navigating an asteroid field).

1for1
 
1for1 said:
They will go down like the titanic.. steedy she blows... IMO 2012 is the year for Physical Silver over-supply.. its like the mints in the world got mega busy for the year of the Dragon.. this oversupply will be a massive stress test for bullion and premium product's ability to stay above issue price..

My prediction is 75% of all dragon coins will having shrinking premiums and will battle to stay afloat.. for non-dragon items its not looking much better...

Sir, the possibility of another red-back spider (like) PM issue are approximately three thousand, seven hundred and eighteen to one! (very similar to the chances of successfully navigating an asteroid field).

1for1
Click to expand...

LOL. I agree. Dragon issues on ebay are sinking fast.
 
1for1 said:
They will go down like the titanic.. steedy she blows... IMO 2012 is the year for Physical Silver over-supply.. its like the mints in the world got mega busy for the year of the Dragon.. this oversupply will be a massive stress test for bullion and premium product's ability to stay above issue price..

My prediction is 75% of all dragon coins will having shrinking premiums and will battle to stay afloat.. for non-dragon items its not looking much better...

Sir, the possibility of another red-back spider (like) PM issue are approximately three thousand, seven hundred and eighteen to one! (very similar to the chances of successfully navigating an asteroid field).

1for1
Click to expand...
Red dwarf?
 
thatguy said:
1for1 said:
They will go down like the titanic.. steedy she blows... IMO 2012 is the year for Physical Silver over-supply.. its like the mints in the world got mega busy for the year of the Dragon.. this oversupply will be a massive stress test for bullion and premium product's ability to stay above issue price..

My prediction is 75% of all dragon coins will having shrinking premiums and will battle to stay afloat.. for non-dragon items its not looking much better...

Sir, the possibility of another red-back spider (like) PM issue are approximately three thousand, seven hundred and eighteen to one! (very similar to the chances of successfully navigating an asteroid field).

1for1
Click to expand...
Red dwarf?
Click to expand...

Return of the Jedi
 
Depending on what the PM does with the snake (if there is a high relief which I personally think there will be) - I think this one will actually be pretty good in the long term.

Other than this one - most have gone above the RRP ($110) - so no loss yet. Quite a few were bought for resale and to see a price sag a bit after the initial burst of activity is not unusual (refer to any lunar series over the last few years). Give it 6-12 months and see if you can pick any up for less than RRP - I'll be pretty surprised.

malachii
 
that is the excitement of ebay, can score bargains if you hang out for a while.... these have been averaging $135 plus postage. Last one I sold for $150 plus postage to an overseas buyer... they are not quite dead...yet...
 
Give it a few years when people are trying to fill their lunar high relief collection they will be a hit....

They won't drop the lunar high relief. The lunar series is the Perth mint cash cow..

And if your too blind to see that bad luck.

The lunar single coins will always be a hit because there is probably 20 times the number of collectors who can afford them, compared to the set coins..

Hence the square sets bombing.
 
silverfever said:
Ouch! This sold for AUD$91.00.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-RELIEF...30719393912?pt=AU_Bullion&hash=item4d00697878

Makes me happy that I got out of this dud by breaking even.
Click to expand...

I went through all the non slabbed completed sales I could find since this coin sold and the average price (including S&H) for the 13 auctions is around $160. The auction you reference went for about $115 (including S&H). Not sure I see how one sale indicates anything other than somebody got a deal (as was mentioned earlier).
 
badhop55 said:
silverfever said:
Ouch! This sold for AUD$91.00.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-RELIEF...30719393912?pt=AU_Bullion&hash=item4d00697878

Makes me happy that I got out of this dud by breaking even.
Click to expand...

I went through all the non slabbed completed sales I could find since this coin sold and the average price (including S&H) for the 13 auctions is around $160. The auction you reference went for about $115 (including S&H). Not sure I see how one sale indicates anything other than somebody got a deal (as was mentioned earlier).
Click to expand...

Still no money to be made when an auction goes for $160 including shipping and handling. The only people profitting from the High Relief Dragons are PM, Paypal and Ebay ... I forgot the Postal service.
 
I'll watch the 5oz proof dragon closely. I think most of the $100 plus per ounce dragons will be a flop. Easy money for the mint but too much of a good thing.

Let's use the 5oz proof as an example -

5000 x 5oz = 25'000oz's x $29.50 = $737'500 worth of silver at current spot.

5000 x $495 = $2'475'000

How do you turn less than 3/4 of a million dollars in silver to almost $2.5million worth of product? Stamp a Dragon on it and use words like "limited edition", "high relief" and "proof"

The milking of the Dragon mania has no end is sight. The big question is will $495 worth of 5oz proof dragon outperform $495 worth of bullion dragon? My money is on the plain old bullion Dragon for return on investment.

You can almost get 3 bullion 5oz dragons for the price of the proof. The main factor will be the final mintage numbers on the bullion 5oz and I suspect it could be lower than most people think. A lot of money has been chasing the premium product that would have otherwise been spent on the bullion coins.
Only time will tell......
 
Bullion Baron said:
bennybbc said:
The big question is will $495 worth of 5oz proof dragon outperform $495 worth of bullion dragon? My money is on the plain old bullion Dragon for return on investment.
Click to expand...
+1

I do think the high relief Dragon could be a reasonable performer over the medium term though.
Click to expand...

agreed on both points.
 
silverfever said:
Still no money to be made when an auction goes for $160 including shipping and handling. The only people profitting from the High Relief Dragons are PM, Paypal and Ebay ... I forgot the Postal service.
Click to expand...

OK - not saying the guy made a fortune but if you can't make a profit out of $160 even on ebay/paypal something is wrong.

Purchase price: $110
Postage in: $10 (could be less if part of a larger order or if picked up from a dealer)
Postage out: $10
ebay/paypal fees (11.4% total) - $18.24 (could be less if done f2f or direct deposit)

Total cost: $148.24

Profit on $160 sale = $11.76

Numbers could be a bit + or - here or there but the overall $150 inc post would be about breakeven.

malachii

PS - To say Dragon hype has come and gone based on the non sale of Gilded dragons is misleading. I'm not sure any gilded product has ever done well on the secondary market - or the primary for that matter (Perth mint still has gilded tigers, ox and rabbits in stock!).
 
Those are good points but for us living across the pond postage from the PM if I remember correctly was $25-$30 and we were limited to 1 coin per order.
 
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