W&F: Will your Gold expire within 186.1 days? Gold Kill Switch

W

Water&Food

New Member
Date: 5th Feb 2012
Author: Water&Food


THE RANT STUFF
In another episode of ponders and tinkering, Inspector Bull ponders on the idea if it is possible to 'program' a kill switch within Gold.
Wait, wait, wait, you may digress. Gold is a damm Metal (and a mmm....shiney one at that). WTF (what) do you mean by 'program' a kill switch? Hello? Gold is not a damm electronic device, you may troll (respond). I could not agree with you totally more.
However, SS Inspector Bull unearthed grave possibilities that even professional conspiracy theorists would shun and cry, he is one crazy %$*#.

Let us go on a journey together to find out if it is possible to bait n switch whilst intentionally adding in a "kill switch" into Gold.


THE INTRO STUFF
A "kill switch" is a concept known to some where an intentional feature has been installed, programmed, added, fused, or mixed in for the sole purpose of shortening the life expectancy of a product. This concept is mainly known to be used in electronic devices. However, this is implemented and used worldwide in all industries coming under other names such as the Light Bulb Conspiracy. To make you the consumer buy more, spend more, again and again.
There is a reason 'we' say, "they don't make them like they use to".
There is a reason things are not made to last.
There is a reason why it seems so damm expensive to replace simple parts that are propriety.
This is the "Kill Switch" - a concept to shorten the life of a product.


THE TECHNICAL STUFF
Gold has more than one Isotope. In fact, Gold has a total of 37 Isotopes. This means, there are literally 37 different 'kinds' of Gold in existence (this is not the same as Karat or different impurities such as 18k or 9k).

Now, Gold is considered (i.e. marketed as to the mass) as only having one stable isotope, 197Au. This is 'somewhat' true. However, it depends on your definition of 'stable' and for 'how long'. If stable means, "humans have not lived long enough to observe or experiment with 197AU breaking down naturally on its own without KFC fingers eating away at the side", then this is also true. 197AU (stable gold) does not have a half life since it is not considered a radionuclide (radioactive isotope) nor a metastable isotope (long but not indefinite life). It was, is, and will always forever be, Gold.
197AU Gold is just considered an indefinite stable isotope, that will:
  • Never break down and always be the same as it was yesterday (given the context). You wont find bits missing on it the next day, unless the Drop Bear had a nibble[/*]
But, what if you found out your Gold did break down and was missing some weight? As if to imply it went on a diet and lost weight.

-------------------------
DID YOU KNOW?
Gold has a 'cousin' named Roentgenium that is considered to be more noble than Gold and rarer than Silver
--------------------------


THE GETTING TO THE POINT STUFF
Let's go back to them 36 other known isotopes of Gold (you know those perceived 'unstable' ones). Of these isotopes (known to public) four of them have half lives of more than 2 days. This means each isotope will not lose half of its mass till 2 days has elapsed. Of these four one stands out to outlive them all, isotope 195Au, with a half-life of 186.1 days (approx).

Here is a layman breakdown; if you had one ounce of 195Au (the 'unstable' isotope of Gold with a half life of 186.1 days) and you came back to 'check' on that ounce by weighing it with scales/balances in 186.1 days, you will discover it will no longer weigh 31.1 grams or one troy ounce, instead it will only weigh 15.55 grams (half an ounce). In 186.1 days you would of lost half a troy ounce!
Even though isotope 195Au (i.e. the talked about unstable gold) is radioactive, and you may very well get radioactive poisoning, this is not the point.

For the record, of the publicly known Gold isotopes to exist only two of them are not radioactive, and these are 197Au (the most stable of all) and 202Au. However, isotope 202 only has a measly half life of 22 seconds (apparently).


-------------------------
DID YOU KNOW?
Gold can be created (synthesized) from mercury using photoneutron process Gold was first synthesized from mercury by neutron bombardment in 1941.
--------------------------


THE CONSPIRACY TO END ALL GOLD CONSPIRACIES STUFF
Now, suppose a crook (and a shifty cyclops he is) wanted to pull one over your head by selling you 'Gold' which contained both the stable 197 and unstable 195 isotopes in equal proportions (i.e. 50:50) just cause he can. What if that same crook also had 'secret' isotopes not known to the general public which was actually stable for 50 or perhaps even 100 years? What if that same crook were to instead sell you that secret isotope of Gold which only started decaying (i.e. losing weight) after 50 years had elapsed?
What is stopping that same crook (whom also drinks Manhattan Experiment Martinis with JP Morgan and HSBC CEOs) from ripping you off whilst he actually keeps all for himself the stable 197 isotope whilst you and I are left with all the crap unstable isotopes of Gold?
What is stopping that crook from mix n matching isotopes to you or I?

My point is this; how certain are you that the Gold you have only contains the 197 stable isotope which lasts indefinitely and not one of the unstable isotopes or a 'secret' isotope? Crooks don't care about doing the 'right' thing. Crooks don't care if you may get radioactive poisoning. Crooks don't care about ripping you off.


THE SUMMARY STUFF
Tungsten filled bars is the last of your worries, at least it is not radioactive! Just because the bar seems stable from outward appearances whom really knows what lays beneath (unless testing the isotope). XRF analyzers and scans are useless, since neither is good enough to test within bars as to what isotope it contains. All known tests that are available to the public at small costs are unable to test isotopes.
197Au isotope is Gold as is 195Au isotope.
All the Gold isotopes are 'Gold', but as you have learned, not all Gold is equal.

Don't be surprised to wake up the next morning one day to find half of your gold stack shrunk in size. It was not the Drop Bear or burglar that did it. ;)

Don't be so sure or believe everything you hear or read. Just because 'they' say Gold is an apparent perceived Monoisotopic element does not mean it is true. There are probably dozens of Gold isotopes with half lives more than one year and possible stable isotopes not known to the general public. Money talks.
I wonder who funds 'Gold' research? ;)

I would not be surprised to hear of crooks in the future (if not occurring already) selling/trading filled unstable isotopes. This will be the 'new' type of fraudulent selling of gold, and you read it here first.


===================

This has been another presentation of W&F mini series, All That Glitters is not Gold: Beyond Rationale :P
You read it here on SilverStackers.com first. Copyright applies, and you must ask owner of silverstackers.com forums for permission.

===================
 
I would be double checking those 'tamper proof' gold bars offered by some mints. Quite convenient to offer 'protective cases' which perhaps 'encloses' the radioactivity emitting from partial unstable 195Au isotopes (half life of 186.1 days). :lol:
 
Makes sense caretakers and storepersons handling Gold at LBMA and COMEX wear 'gloves' (it ain't to keep KFC finger prints off). :lol:
.
 
Hey +1 for crazy :lol:
But there are, and always have been, many crazy things going on that don't become apparent till waaaaay after the fact.
Same potential problem with Silver?
 
Same for every isotope, every metal, every product. Anything where isotopes can be fkd around with.
No bullion metal is exempt from possible 'kill switch'.
But, to get the most widest attention I opted on focusing on Gold and letting the audience figure out the rest.

Thanks for the response.
+1 to your observation
 
Would mean dated coins would ensure their validity ;)
No more undated blobs of gold for me :lol:
As an aside, are these isotopes found in naturally occurring gold (nuggets)?
If so I'm going to have to weigh and catalogue them all now :/
(If there's any left now....)
 
The unstable isotopes were found in nuggets but have long decayed leaving only stable 197Au behind.
In short; All Nuggets are safe.

BONUS:
All Gold predating the year 1941 is deemed safe* and stable with only the 197Au isotope remaining.

*just in case 'they' discovered how to bait n switch Gold back in the photoneutron process and cyclotron days

Personally, I perceive all Nuggets (any year) and Gold pre-dating 1941 as FTW safe. The closer you move to present date the higher likelihood of unstable isotope traces (or intentionally planted) remaining.

Does not matter on size or quantity to be a candidate for having unstable isotopes. Even though you would assume the 1/10th ozt Gold Kangaroos are 'safe', but these coins normally come in capsules. However, just weigh on scales/balances.

As a precaution, always weigh metals out of their accompanying capsules (if they have one) before committing to purchase. The older the metal the less likelihood of unstable isotope traces remaining.
Just don't touch any Gold younger than 2 x 186.1 days (372.2 days = nearly a year)! :O

I hope this post helps with fear or concern. :)
 
Water&Food said:
The unstable isotopes were found in nuggets but have long decayed leaving only stable 197Au behind.
In short; All Nuggets are safe.
Click to expand...




Phew :cool:
 
Wow! Thank you for opening my eyes. Now I see why people rapidly start balding and lose thier teeth aproximately after age 50. We're all exposed to radioactive unstable gold!
:mad:
 
Ummmm yeah

Don't want to get too technical for ya, but did you notice that the daughter isotope for Au195 is Pt195.

So in your hypothetical purchase of 1/2 Au197 and 1/2 Au195, when all the Au195 decays, you end up with 50:50 Au:Pt.

Not such a bad outcome.


Edit: Oh and natural occurance of Au197 is 1.0000 so all the other isotopes only exist in a lab.

Pt195 is also a stable natural isotope of Pt.


But interesting info, who knows maybe the question will come up in the next SilverStackers Quiz night. :P
 
glam said:
but did you notice that the daughter isotope for Au195 is Pt195.
Click to expand...
Yes, but that was not the argument in original post. Original post proposes the possibility of exotic unstable isotopes being bait n switched with stable natural isotopes. Raising questions for concern.

glam said:
Edit: Oh and natural occurance of Au197 is 1.0000 so all the other isotopes only exist in a lab.
Click to expand...
Exactly. As I said in original post and follow up. I also explain more in Part 2 of the Isotope series.

Thanks.

Look forward to observing your comments on Part 2. :)
 
in your theory of when its safe to buy gold (if this kind of thing is possible and does happen.) you forget the fact that half life isnt half the time for all the radioactive isotope to disappear. its the time it takes for half the remaining isotopes to disappear.

0 days = all radioactive isotopes.
186.1 days = 1/2 are radioactive
372.2 days = 1/4 are radioactive
558.3 days = 1/8 are radioactive and so on and so on.

so depending on how big the block is it takes a long time to be safe.

and the item made of this gold will lose minimal weight. as stated above. 195Au turns into 195Pt
with the material being ejected turning into a hydrogen or anti hydrogen particle if i remember correctly.
 
ok ok ... let's settle this - It's more expensive to create the various conconcted isotopes of gold in labs than it is to mine it.

W&F, you're a very imaginative person. I'm more worried about house dragons and other unexplained phenomenon than my gold being radioactive and likely to decline in weight.
 
Are you talking about a conspiracy of producing these isotopes with short half-lives, or simply obtaining them and selling them as stable gold?

If it is in the producing, the cost of production (according to your own calculations in the other thread) would outweigh the value many times over. If you are worried about them obtaining these isotopes naturally I just keep thinking to myself "How the hell would they obtain enough, early enough (before it shrinks) to make it worthwhile producing and selling them in gold bars?!" Let alone the fact that dealers often hold gold over a period of time and would note VERY early that their supplies were shrinking physically!

Also, wouldn't it be fairly easy to determine if this was the case? Any minted and dated coin would be safe, any nugget, anything sold by local or trusted refiners. In fact, buy anything and weigh it and you should be right. Of course, if you were planning on holding your gold for 50+ years, this information would be coming in to the masses and various other identification methods would be provided to ensure you are buying stable gold. Then there is the obvious law suits ets that would follow, making this a completely pointless and frivolous exercise.

Cool information, but I see no practical application and absolutely no need to be worried about the type of gold I buy now, or in the years to come.
 
Water&Food said:
Here is a layman breakdown; if you had one ounce of 195Au (the 'unstable' isotope of Gold with a half life of 186.1 days) and you came back to 'check' on that ounce by weighing it with scales/balances in 186.1 days, you will discover it will no longer weigh 31.1 grams or one troy ounce, instead it will only weigh 15.55 grams (half an ounce). In 186.1 days you would of lost half a troy ounce!
Click to expand...

More on half-life:
http://www.iem-inc.com/prhlfr.html

Incidentally, it is easy to consider that gold in smaller quantities, particularly minted (even counterfeit) coins would be extremely unlikely to ever be such a Gold isotope. This is simply because it takes time to mint these products (and they might not take too well to minting), then time to distribute and sell them, all the while the weight would be decreasing (albeit slowly).

Perth Mint doesn't post that fast.

Plus any coin/bar that is at least 6 months old is no longer eligible, and it would be obvious.

Add to this any of the other points SS members have made such as cost of the isotope.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top