Avoid tax by paying in face value ?

Wouldn't the tradies income also be a lot lower? I mean after materials he might even be making a loss ;)
 
yeah sure try it and see what the tax office does if they catch you. even better try to fake your way through customs declaring only the face value of the coins, what could possibly go wrong...
 
Don't know.

Try it, and if you get caught let us know how it turns out. :)


Heard of the IRS in the US going after someone who was paying his contractors with silver or gold eagles
 
Prosecutors at the Kahre trial showed that defendants selectively assigned a value of their coin income -- switching between face value and market value -- depending on whether they were trying to lower their tax liability or qualify for a home or car loan.
Click to expand...

This is the kicker - they did it to minimise tax. You can bet they weren't buying groceries and paying 200oz of ASEs for a $200 cart of groceries. It's all about the intent - they intended to avoid tax.

This isn't an endorsement of taxation. Just pointing out where they fell afoul of the environment they lived and did business in.
 
Verrry interested in this question GP,
but overall I don't understand tax evasion.

These people are worse than the mafia and have endless resources to apply to getting what they think they're owed. You maybe make an extra few thousand and they'll spend a hundred thousand to hunt you down and fine you and hassle you for years and years after.

Just pay the tax they say you have to and have as little to do with them all as is possible.
 
When the market value is above the face value the ATO looks at the market value and treats it as a barter transaction so you would pay GST on the market value.
 
goldpelican said:
Regarding customs - read http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/files/ImportingPreciousMetalCoinsandBullions.pdf - never declare gold again (if it's personal use).
Click to expand...

Did you miss the section in your link where it say's
Most imported goods with a value of more than A$1,000
must be declared on an import declaration.
Click to expand...

Or am I missing something...........

I read it as you still have to declare it, but yo will not have to pay any duty or GST on it.
 
goanna said:
If you paid him with an Australian coin, it would legal tender status for starters.
Click to expand...
This is what I wonder about. Since a $200 gold coin is legal tender couldn't you pay your tradie with it? It's up to him and no concern of yours if he can sell it for more.
 
Of course you can pay him with a $200 coin, but he can't give you $1500 worth of services for a $200 coin, and then claim he was only paid $200.

Well he can, and he can put it on his tax return and all will be rosy until he gets audited and then things will get interesting.

You can claim anything you like on your tax return and everyone knows a guy who claimed X because his tax agent said he could, but the buck stops with you if it's your tax return. A tax agent is no more responsible for what you claim than the guy down the pub. If he says you can deduct the cost of hookers and you get a refund based on that information it doesn't make it a legit deduction, it just means you get to wait a few years to see if your name pops up for an audit or get away with it.

If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is?
 
glam said:
goldpelican said:
Regarding customs - read http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/files/ImportingPreciousMetalCoinsandBullions.pdf - never declare gold again (if it's personal use).
Click to expand...

Did you miss the section in your link where it say's
Most imported goods with a value of more than A$1,000
must be declared on an import declaration.
Click to expand...

Or am I missing something...........

I read it as you still have to declare it, but yo will not have to pay any duty or GST on it.
Click to expand...

I'm referring to carrying gold in on your person. From the same link:

Import declarations are not required if imported goods are the accompanied personal effects of arriving passengers or crew (of a ship or aircraft) unless the goods are commercial goods.
Click to expand...
 
goldpelican said:
glam said:
goldpelican said:
Regarding customs - read http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resources/files/ImportingPreciousMetalCoinsandBullions.pdf - never declare gold again (if it's personal use).
Click to expand...

Did you miss the section in your link where it say's
Most imported goods with a value of more than A$1,000
must be declared on an import declaration.
Click to expand...

Or am I missing something...........

I read it as you still have to declare it, but yo will not have to pay any duty or GST on it.
Click to expand...

I'm referring to carrying gold in on your person. From the same link:

Import declarations are not required if imported goods are the accompanied personal effects of arriving passengers or crew (of a ship or aircraft) unless the goods are commercial goods.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

ok so i'll rephrase my previous question slightly differently then...
1. are you saying then that as long as i carry my 100K worth of gold bullion/coins on my person that i don't need to declare it?
2. Does "on my person" include that which i carry in my carry-on luggage?
 
Now of course up until quite recently - when western countries actually respected common law property rights - possession was 90% of the law, so for example if one was found to have say $100K worth of gold on one's person or under one's floorboards then it would be assumed that this gold belonged to the person or houseowner. The state would only question the bona fide ownership of the gold IF there was evidence to suggest that the gold was in fact stolen from its true owner (eg serial numbers matched stolen goods etc).

However, in today's f..d up world where western governments have introduced all sorts of draconian legislation to enable them to easily steal the private property of individuals, the state can simply say that unless you can provide "documented evidence" that you own the gold, then you are assumed to be guilty, until you can prove yourself innocent - and the state goons can therefore take the gold from you...

Is this something that you are aware of?
 
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