A thought on aust gov silver confiscation, comments welcome

D

Dr.Gold

Member
I had a thought this morning when I woke up about the types of silver that the aust gov might not be able to confiscate if they tried to take it.

They could probably regulate and take any generic bar or round and if I recall correctly someone here mentioned that all perth mint and RAM coins that have legal tender status are only permanently 'leased' can can be recalled by the government if it desired so.

So what about legal tender coins from another country? Such as US silver eagles? They are effectively USD, even though their face value is far below their bullion value.

The aust gov can regulate all AUD, wether it be in digital format in a bank or cash in a wallet, but do they have the authority to control and appropriate foreign currencies?

If they tried to take all silver (and gold for that matter) and they took silver eagles as well it would be the same as taking US greenback noted out of peoples pockets and saying 'we have ultimate authority on this' when it is obvious that the US gov is the ultimate authority on USD.

So if silver was confiscated, could they leave legal tender silver and gold coins from foreign countries out of the theft?

Regards,

DG
 
It's not going to happen with silver. Not even worth worrying about.

Gold confiscation is more probable, but even that's highly unlikely.
 
The Americans can be a bit lax about other peoples' borders. I would be more worried about them trying to get their legal tender back off us. I am sure if they asked the Australian Government nicely then we would roll over, in much the same way the Swedish Government rolled over when the Americans wanted to prosecute swedes living in Sweden who had broken no Swedish laws.

The Americans have already confiscated silver in our lifetime and got away with it, no reason to suspect the Australians wouldn't do the same thing. In the American case, the FBI decalred that the silver was counterfeit and confiscated the lot. In reality the silver stolen was not counterfeit, it was there to backwarehouse receipts. The receipts weren't considered to be counterfeit and owning a receipt for silver stored in a warehouse was also not a crime. But never-the-less, the FBI took it off the people who had committed no crime and they show no sign of giving it back. $7 million of silver confiscated.

Not to mention the last time they confiscated all the silver in '57 I think it was when they printed the last of the Silver certificates and swapped to the Federal Reserve Dollars which were no longer backed by silver. Instead of having ounces in the bank redeemable with a silver certificate they just gave you a different piece of paper and told you it was worth the same. I have some silver certificates but I can't redeem them because the Government changed the rules, not to help me but to help themselves, these are the people you are dealing with.

Australia confiscated silver in 1966, they did it subtly by first taking away half your silver in 1945 and then taking away the rest in 1964. They replaced it with cupronickel and made a fortune selling your silver. You didn't have to comply of course, your savings would have been wiped out but you would have a nice stack to play with. I guess at the time it made sense to swap over as spot was lower.

Laws can be made for anything if it is considered financially worthwhile. Is it worth all the effort just to collect silver? If Silver goes to the moon it might be but if there was any chance that silver was gong to the moon the governments would be buying it now while it is cheap. Instead they have dumped all their reserves.

Even if they didn't confiscate it they could restrict the buying and selling of the stuff until you became a criminal if you tried. If it went to the moon but you couldn't sell it then it might as well be worthless. I guess they could have an amnesty and give you the opportunity to hand it in.

I think that is a long way off though.

I think it would start a lot slower than that.

First there would be the requirement to keep all receipts, for buying and selling, just so that you could prove it wasn't stolen and to explain any large sums entering your bank account, if you have done nothing wrong then you should have no concerns complying with this.

Then maybe the requirement to have it insured, much as I am forced to insure my house from flooding. And probably secure storage will have to used, for the protection of your stash and to meet with the new insurance requirements.

Possibly a requirement to have a licence to deal in precious metals, and maybe a few vetting procedures to make sure that only the right people are involved in the trade. Everything else you need a licence for.

Then maybe mandatory audits to ensure that you still have the metals that you claim to have.

Anyone who now has a bar of silver hidden in the back garden is in breach of so many laws it is unbelieveable, plus if you want to sell it you would have to be dealing directly with the criminal element.

I might get all mine melted down into religious artifacts, the gov is so keen not to offend anyone for their religious beliefs I feel they would have a hard time confiscating a few crosses.

I personally like the Tiffany & Co. Salem Flatware (knives and forks), I have been trying to pick up some more flatware for a while now, I already have some serving spoons which get daily use. I am not sure that the gov would come looking for cutlery and it is a damn sight more useful than the safe full of snakes I have.
 
As the Cyprus episod has shown, they will probably start by trying to confiscate your electronic cash: a lot more people involved (understand greater revenue) and a lot less efforts!
 
I guess that the obvious silver 'kinds' to confisquate would be registered / official stocks. Alike dealer vaults in customs depots, ETF stocks, etc. It's not much hassle for the politburo, just force them to close, just like they force bank offices to close.
What is the chance that this happens? If I put myself in the politburo's position, their main care is that people cannot evade their tax. So, IF too many people / too big part of the economy would start using silver in monetary roles, the politburo will certainly intervene/confisquate/block access to these most obvious 'kinds'.
There is an order of things to recognize here, where they gradually make it easier for themselves to intervene: first everything on paper (stock notes, etc) moved to electronics/databanks. Then limits on cash transactions. Then lower those limits (which is what happened in recent years in many countries). Why? Simple: the politburo follows the evasion paths, and if silver is/becomes one, they will, once again, follow.
The silver 'kind' stored in whatever places, unregistered, though, well, it would be alot hassle/cost for them to find&confisquate it. So I think that's pretty safe, at least if you take some basic care.
 
Australian Constitution Section 115 states: "A State shall not coin money, nor make anything but gold and silver coin a legal tender in payment of debts."

To change this requirement is quite simple. All they need is a change to a Republic, and hence a new constitution with this inconvenient clause removed!
 
We don't need to be a republic to change the constitution do we? I thought we just needed the green light from the Queen/Attorney-General?
 
boston said:
Australian Constitution Section 115 states: "A State shall not coin money, nor make anything but gold and silver coin a legal tender in payment of debts."

To change this requirement is quite simple. All they need is a change to a Republic, and hence a new constitution with this inconvenient clause removed!
Click to expand...

Confused...I thought the requirement had already been changed, none of my debts are paid in gold or silver.
 
You know Jislizard, you can be scary sometimes. This is exactly what I'd do if I was doing it!!!

Jislizard said:
First there would be the requirement to keep all receipts, for buying and selling, just so that you could prove it wasn't stolen and to explain any large sums entering your bank account, if you have done nothing wrong then you should have no concerns complying with this.

Then maybe the requirement to have it insured, much as I am forced to insure my house from flooding. And probably secure storage will have to used, for the protection of your stash and to meet with the new insurance requirements.

Possibly a requirement to have a licence to deal in precious metals, and maybe a few vetting procedures to make sure that only the right people are involved in the trade. Everything else you need a licence for.

Then maybe mandatory audits to ensure that you still have the metals that you claim to have.
Click to expand...

And aren't we already past step one? Any Police Force in the country would be happy to seize anything you hold of value, claiming it to be ill-gotten gains and hold it (or liquidate it and spend it) until you can prove it's not! And the only way to do that is ..... keep receipts! It's not a legal requirement for you to keep receipts of course, just as its not a requirement for you to quote your tax file number. But the consequences for not doing so are "inconvenient" shall we say?

Roll on the Police State! What a pity they confiscated all the firearms! I'm beginning to become a bit US Second Amendment!!
 
SilverPhoenix said:
This is exactly what I'd do if I was doing it!!!
Click to expand...

Well like many things, they may not be made illegal but they would be so heavily regulated they wouldn't be worth the effort.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top