"The numbers show that if you had bought a new 1-ounce silver Panda each year from 2000 through 2010, the cost would have been $334. At the end of may 2011, those coins would have been worth $1,418." Source: http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Article.jsp?ad=article&ArticleId=22093&et_mid=511838&rid=2216902
From where I've been sitting, the Panda has outperformed generic silver (e.g. Maples) by leaps and bounds. If I had purchased $10,000AUD worth of silver Maples in 2009, about 500oz of silver, today I would have doubled my money (spot $16/oz to $32/oz). [Maples then about $20, now $40] (100% Gain) [Fiat now worth $20,000AUD] If I had purchased $10,000AUD worth of silver Pandas in 2009, about 454oz of silver, today I would have more than quadrupled my money!!! [Panda then about $22, now $95] [Fiat now worth $43,181.82AUD] If you buy Maples, you are merely preserving your "real" net worth (which is much better than holding cash). A Maple in 2009 is worth a Maple in 2011. No loss nor gain. You only win against fiat. If you buy Pandas, you are gaining interest on your silver. A Panda in 2009 is worth at least 2 Pandas in 2011. You have gained. You win against fiat AND you win against other bullion. This has also been explored in this discussion topic: http://forums.silverstackers.com/topic- rison.html - [News] Two MS-69 ASEs go for $100 - Panda Comparison
Re silver v gold pandas, is it generally safer to just get the gold pandas with the mint n the packaging due to the uncertainty re the silver fakes?
Fakes are an issue, but they aren't a huge issue as many pandaphobes would make them out to be. Panda Collector and the china-mint forum actively help find any fakes that might be in the market, including the dodgy ones on Ebay. http://www.pandacollector.com/rogue.html http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php
Yennus may recognize me as a member of the china-mint forum. I've warned the members of that forum about fakes that I saw on Ebay. I won't say that I'm an expert on fake silver pandas but once you get used to how they look most fakes are fairly easy to spot due to obvious differences from the original. Some examples I saw are: no denomination, wrong denomination and/or year, poor quality of the strike (the real ones usually have very good quality of strike), etc. Aside from the pandacollector website above, I highly recommend Peter Anthony's Gold and Silver Panda Coin Buyer's Guide. Peter is also the man behind the pandacollector.com website and his book shows you pictures of real panda coins for every year, which you can compare to the ones you are planning to buy. Another piece of advice I can give is for you to buy a pocket scale from AWS (American Weigh Scales). They are very handy and useful for finding fakes. The real 1 oz. pandas should weigh anywhere between 1.18 to 1.26 troy ounces (with the capsule and plastic seal). The extra weight is due to the weight of the capsule and plastic seal (if it's still there). Fakes will weigh less than that because of the lighter weight of the base metals used. Sorry for the long post. I hope this information is helpful.
I bought 6 but received 4 fakes and 2 never arrived from eBay. Ended up getting one from Downies last Friday for $56!
Welcome here mate, thanks for the info, it's a good forum that china mint forum, pop over to the "Welcome New Members" sub-forum and say g'day
For newcomers to Chinese coin collecting eBay is a very dangerous place to buy coins. It is much safer and in the long run a better strategy to buy from well-known and respected dealers. Best wishes, Peter Anthony http://www.pandacollector.com
what about slabbed pandas? my eyes have been caught by some pandas as of late, MS69's especially. are these safer than normal, uncarded pands off ebay? and are they a good place to start as a panda collector?
Please forgive a newbie's question... When one says "slabbed", are we referring to coins that have been graded by NCG or PCGS?
Safer and more expensive, 69's are 1.5 - 2x unslabbed prices, even 3x depending on the coin. Again, as long as you buy genuiine slabbed coins Price, reputation of seller etc are critical. Raw coins off ebay can offer a great deal, as long as you know what you are doing. I would suggest buying unslabbed coins from reputable dealers before buying slabbed ones. You can sell them easier on this forum once you've built some trading feedback. If you want to buy slabbed coins, then be prepared to pay extra and wait a few years before a market establishes itself in this country - it will eventually, don't worry, but it will take time. Hopefully the market in years to come in australia will be for both slabbed and unslabbed pieces, offering all prospective buyers a choice of product. The way I see it is, slabbed if you want to hold for 5 - 10 or more years, unslabbed if you look to sell in the next 2 - 3 years. If going slabbed for the long haul, 69's and 70's are the only choice. Anything less is to be treated like an unslabbed coin, maybe with a tiny extra premium for it's certification.
Thanks rbaggio and mmm....shiney! It's nice to be part of this forum too so I can hear different perspectives on the Chinese panda coins. I also like some Aussie coins so I'm happy to be here.
Hey Mrslick32!!! Welcome to Silverstackers!!! It's an honor to have you amongst us. Thanks for your words of wisdom. They are greatly appreciated.
The 5 oz. silver pandas are very beautiful and have a huge diameter of 70mm! I love to collect them since they look very nice on my collection. You got a really good price for that 5 oz. panda. I don't think it will happen very often so take advantage when you see the opportunity.
I love the 3-d Temple of Heaven on those 5 oz'ers but they seem only to be on the earlier years only? Current ones seem to have be just 2-d.
The 3-D Temple of Heaven designs are on the 5 oz'ers for the following years: 1987, 1989 to 1995. The 2-D Temple of Heaven designs are on the 5 oz'ers for the following years: 1988, 2003 to present. I wonder why China decided to use the 2-D design on the 1988 release. I love the 3-D design too. It's very attractive. The 3-D designs can also be found on the 12 oz'ers issued from 1988 to 1997.
I still have a lot to learn about the Chinese pandas, which is one reason why I find them so interesting to collect. They never cease to amaze me because the Chinese Mint released so many different date sizes (China's version of mintmarks), sizes of coins, and panda designs since 1982.
