Coupla quick Q's about SMSFs??

Discussion in 'Superannuation' started by thatguy, Jun 10, 2011.

  1. thatguy

    thatguy Active Member

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    Hi just a quick coupla Q's

    1) The money for starting it up, can that come from your super or does it have to come from your income?

    2) The money for maintaining it, can that come from your super or does it have to come from your income?

    3) Can you combine supers from say you wife? Siblings?

    4) If moving overseas before retiring what happens then? Is it the same for regular super in regards to moving OS?

    Thanx for you time :)
     
  2. Ossie

    Ossie Member

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    1) It came come from your existing super, and then you add to it by contributions from your income or from employer super payments

    2) You can use the money already in your super to maintain it. ie. you dont use your income or salary to maintain your SMSF

    3) Yes, I think you can have upto 4? Trustees on your SMSF. (Its always easier to mantain with your partner though...)

    4)Yes same as regular Super.
     
  3. thatguy

    thatguy Active Member

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    "If you establish a SMSF on or before 15 June, 2011, it is FREE to set up your own DIY Superfund with ESUPERFUND. This is a saving of $699. In conjunction with our FREE 2011 and 2012 Annual Compliance Fee Offer this is a total saving of $2,097."

    thanx for that just checked the esuperfund.com.au site and they have a good deal on ATM. Just another Q?? I want to combine my super my wife's and my sister's, is this possible with "Individual trustees" or do I need "Corporate Trustees"
     
  4. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

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    You can have up to 4 individual trustees. so if you include yourself that will make 3.
     
  5. goldpelican

    goldpelican Administrator Staff Member

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    Esuperfund have been running that promo for at least a year - each month they just change the date of the promotion.
     
  6. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Are you saying the compliance charge i am guessing auditing fee is the difference between $2,097 and the set up fee of $699=$1400
    If so then 2011-2012 year will be free and each following year will be charged at this rate?

    REDBACK
     
  7. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

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    +1 to that (In reference to the pelican's post) since mid march as far as I can remember, but come the new financial year it'll probably revert back to their standard, free startup or free first year's auditing fees, both of these get rotated on a regular basis as the pelican pointed out.
     
  8. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

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    Didn't quite follow your figures there reddy, (Just worked em out :) ) from the paperwork we've received, we paid no establishment fee, will pay no auditing fee for the financial year 2010-2011 and none for 2011-2012. After that, the annual auditing fee will be $699 which of course is subject to change to cover increasing costs. So we'll pay $699 in 2012-2013.
     
  9. thatguy

    thatguy Active Member

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    OK another quick Q and a mega thanx for answers so far :D. So I am tossing up self storage option but it would mean a good sized safe... is this something the SMSF could purchase or is it something I would need to chime in for?? TIA
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Was trying to figure out where the 2097 savings was quoted from so i assumed this was their normal charge,but you have cleared that up Shiney.
    Cheers Thanks
    PS i am trying to figure out where the catch is here
    Their annual auditing fee is $699,does that include accountant fee's re end of year financials for the super fund.
     
  11. XB

    XB Active Member Silver Stacker

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    According to their site (http://www.esuperfund.com.au/fees/annualfee.aspx) the annual fee (currently $699 but free for next 2 years if join before 15/6 etc) includes:

    "attending to ALL annual compliance obligations for your SMSF for the 2011 and 2012 Financial Years including:

    - Preparation of an annual Balance Sheet
    - Preparation of an annual Profit & Loss Statement
    - Preparation of annual Member Statements
    - Preparation of annual Trustee Resolutions & Minutes
    - Preparation of an annual Income Tax Return
    - Preparation of an annual Audit"

    I have the esuperfund site as a tab in browser permanently as I allow all the various things to percolate around in my mind - one day I'll reach a decision :) and yea, I keep looking for the catch too mate...
     
  12. XB

    XB Active Member Silver Stacker

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    my understanding is the SMSF can fund the safe. I'm pretty sure this was addressed somewhere in one of the other discussions within the Superannuation forum
     
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thanks XB

    So they take a hit for the first 2 years and then the fee's creep in..Don't know- maybe?
    Regardless at the moment for the first 2 years that is a good deal and i guess if they increase fee's hugely one can always take their bat and ball and go home.Which brings me to exit penalties-any?
    After 2 years what is their fee structure is this in their contract?

    REDBACK
     
  14. XB

    XB Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Yea that's my understanding - fees atm are $699, but they say they may increase but

    "After the 2013 Financial Year the annual compliance fee will be reviewed annually. If there is a change to the annual compliance fee, the change will be notified by ESUPERFUND via this page on our website. Fee Increases where applied will be in line with our aim to ensure our fees are the most competitive in the market on a continual basis. We note that we have had only one modest fee increase in the past decade.

    Not an Introductory Fee

    As detailed above our current low annual fee of $699 per annum is FIXED irrespective of the number of transactions made by your Superfund, the size of your Superfund or the number of Members. The annual compliance fee is not an introductory fee. Our aim is to ensure our fees are the most competitive in the market on a continual basis. Whereas other SMSF providers offer generous first year promotional offers you can be assured our low annual compliance fee will remain low - always. "

    So they say it's not a price leader (ie cheap intro rate to get you on board then increase price and gouge you mercilessly) but they do reserve the option to increase later. Since I'd be paying I'd guess at least this amount to an accountant (assuming I had SMSF not through esuper) then a modest increase anyways in 2 years would not be out of the question.... esp considering I got free set up and 2 yrs free accounting, audit and compliance

    __________


    Edit: sorry missed yr q on exit penalties - can't see anything on it on the site - might be worth a call to them to ask, but I can't think of a reason why there'd be an exit penalty

    .

    Later Edit (following on from the valuable comments from Elemental below) - Found it in here in there Terms and Conditions - http://www.esuperfund.com.au/Libraries/documents/PDS_20122010ES_1.sflb.ashx (should have looked there at the start)

    "Termination of services

    You can terminate the services of ESUPERFUND at any time and for any reason by notifying ESUPERFUND in writing. If you terminate the services of ESUPERFUND prior to having paid at least one (1) years annual compliance fee of $699 then an exit fee of $699 will apply. If you terminate the services of ESUPERFUND and have paid at least one (1) years annual compliance fee of $699 then NO exit fee will apply. Similarly ESUPERFUND can terminate your Fund as a client at any time and for any reason by notifying you in writing. Any fees prepaid by your Fund will be refunded to you in this instance. No further financial obligation will be payable by ESUPERFUND to your Fund in the event of termination."

    Which to me seems more than fair
     
  15. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

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    I haven't seen mention of that in any thread but will have another search, thanks XB. We are going to buy a safe but we did some thinking about this and decided not to even bother asking whether a SMSF could actually fund the purchase of one for these reasons. These are just ideas we had and may not even be correct.

    1. You would probably need to insure the contents, now safes with cash ratings of the sought that could store an increasingly (hopefully) valuable asset such as bullion are hideously expensive. You might start with a cash rated safe of $5000, chuck 2 or 3 1 oz bars in there and in a years time as gold rises in price you might have over $6000 worth of bullion. Then your insurance might not cover what you have.

    2. SMSF money must be invested to secure your financial future in retirement. Spending $2000 or more (say one that's rated to $30000) on a safe puts a bit of a hole in your financial future budget and may be difficult to justify.

    3. Assets purchased must not be for personal use. This means you can't store any of your other stuff in there.

    4. if you do have 10's of 1000's of dollars worth of PM, it would make more sense to have it stored at a secure facility and cheaper in the long run. For example, The Reserve Vault in Brissie costs about $200/year for a tray that can hold 15kg, that's just over $699 000 worth of yellow stuff. There are also other options for large bullion purchases, eg PMDS, BullionMark, Suisse Gold etc.

    5. We decided it might be more prudent to spend some money from the business and use it to store personal/business effects and maybe a couple of SMSF things that we might plan to sell, so as not to have the inconvenience of arranging to pick up anything from secure storage.

    6. Don't have to sleep with my cricket bat - can leave it in my kit to go mouldy.

    7. A big safe would have to be installed by the supplier - unless you own a truck and forklift - so delivery is not a very private matter.
     
  16. Elemental

    Elemental Active Member Silver Stacker

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    The safe could be purchased by the super fund as long as the sole purpose is to store PM's owned by the fund. In terms of eSupers fees etc, they were so good that as an accountant (who can do my own work and also get deeds drawn up at cost price) I have signed up with them. All inclusive (financials, tax and audit) for $700 is an absolute bargin. All waived until 2012-2013. In terms of exit fees the fine print says there will be none as long as you have paid at least one years of fees - so basically, as long as I stay until 2012-2013 and then pay one lot of $700 I can leave with no penalty.

    It really seems to good to be true so while I ave already signed up I'll be waiting for a catch - so far I haven't found one yet. The trust deed we received seems pretty tight and the documentation was pretty good also. You don't get a nice trust file but I can get one of those from officeworks.
     
  17. XB

    XB Active Member Silver Stacker

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    shiney I could be wrong :rolleyes: - I just had some vague recollection in my mind when I posted .... since then I have had a trawl through most of the topics that seemed promising and there are several that mention safes but not in the detail you have (which means I probably AM wrong )....

    Even so our friend Elemental has pretty much answered the question - thanks mate :)

    shiney you make some very cogent points and I agree with you by and large but like everything in life we all have different objective, needs and wants etc so what works best for one wont suit another.....

    I think bottom line is yes the SMSF CAN buy a safe.... but one needs to weigh up one's own circumstances (including those you pointed out) and DYODD as to whether the SMSF SHOULD buy a safe.
     
  18. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

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    +1000000 That's exactly what SMSF's should be about, everyone has different needs and objectives and it should be up to the individual (or trustees) to make decisions on their own behalf that best ensures their future. One size does not fit all my friend.

    You XB, are a true libetarian. Thankyou. :)
     
  19. Ag

    Ag Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Ok someone has to come in and be the Fun Police...

    Setup a SMSF with eSuperfund - easy - my first year running coming up (not expecting a bill)

    As for 'personal self storage' I asked my personal Accountant who suggested against it...if anything goes wrong or the records aren't up to ATO requirements or blah blah blah there could be sh^t to pay...so went the un-allocated storage at Perth Mint (no storage cost) - bugger thing is they have closed un-allocated and only offer allocated (you do pay storage costs)

    ...so this was one persons opinion - maybe no applicable to you,but thought it was worth mentioning...

    good luck :)
     
  20. rbaggio

    rbaggio Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Something else to consider when starting a SMSF, is the TPD (Total Permanent Disablement) insurance that is normally provided by your existing fund. If you setup a SMSF, this is something that YOU now need to fund.
     

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