As per title - specifically looking for 1930M or 1930P full Sov. Preference given to grade over mint. Looking for EF+ as It’s for a gift. Happy to pay the right premium on the right coin. Thanks for looking, Thanks Kilo
If all else fails try Drakesterling, he's selling sovs for spot + 10% and probably has the year you're looking for in stock. Or, be quick (https://www.drakesterling.com/1930-perth-sovereign-37908303)
If you can buy sovereigns from him for spot + 10% then that is quite reasonable, but I would stay away from the PCGS slabbed coins. I regularly come across PCGS graded coins at auctions which have been down graded considerably by the auction houses, some choice Unc PCGS MS 63 Sovereigns down graded to aUnc or even gEF.
Thanks for the link @jultorsk, I knew the last few years saw weak strikes out of Perth even so for this coin to get MS63 is an eye opener.
100% with you on that hardyakkagold, the reasons behind that is a proper can of worms that most of us don’t like to talk about. I prefer a 2x2.
Sorry for the off-topic @kilo .. @hardyakkagold I agree in principle however I struggle to understand why an auction house would wade into 'downgrading' a description of a slabbed coin. Wouldn't that be likely detrimental to the auction result and eventually, discourage potential customers from consigning their coins? I mean, in a way coin slabbing was created in the first place, by definition, to (at least so the theory goes) allow 'apples to apples' comparison of the coins. Also agreed it's curious that the strike does not seem to be a determining factor for grading... well-struck coins get worse grades than their weakling counterparts with more lustrous fields. I think it would be interesting to discuss this can of worms - it's a coin forum and all...
In response to @kilo and @jultorsk, I am not sure but, I think that PCGS and the other slabbing/grading services use the more lax American coin grading guidelines which are not as strict as what has generally been applied in Australia over the years. As for why a coin auction house would downgrade a PCGS or other slabbed and graded coins, the answer is quite simple 'Reputation'. Auction houses (or at least some of the larger reputable ones) build up their clientele and business through truthful and ethical behaviour and honest coin grades. So they would rather incur the wrath and displeasure of the vendor who has consigned the slabbed/graded coin and a lower price, than selling the MS63 graded coin as such when the coin might technically not even be in Unc grade due to slight wear on the high points. They would lose a lot more customers and trust if they just went by what the coin grading services graded the coin as without grading the coin themselves to see if the grade given was correct. Noble Numismatics seems to be the ones with the strictest grading criteria, I have seen them constantly downgrade PCGS coins over the years. Downies used to be good years ago with the previous manager, not so strict with grading any more ( they sold me a fake gold 1 oz roo couple years ago) Some of the smaller auction places are a bit lazy (or shifty) as they dont give their grade for a slabbed coin but the grading companies grade, so its definitely buyer beware with those. I have got quite a few slabbed coins in my collection including a nice PCGS MS 64 Sovereign which I purchased at auction earlier this year for $600. So I am not totally against slabbed coins as such if you can get them for not much more than spot, what I am against is paying 50% (or more) over spot price for a Choice Unc Sovereign which might not even be technically uncirculated. I hope I have not upset the slabbing crowd too much as I know there are some quite fanatical devotees there.
Thanks for your thoughts @hardyakkagold, I have to agree with you. To take the customer focus concept a step further, do you think a grading service may be inclined to be grade up if a coin is between grades, compared to the Australian habit of grading down in the same situation?
, Yes, I think you might be on the money there @kilo. I have not studied or familiarised myself with the PCGS grading system or guidelines but, looking at the Drakesterling sovereigns listing it appears to me that at least some of the coins have been graded up. As an example some of his low numbered VF seem more like our gFine, and some medium numbered look like our aVF. While only the high numerical VF seem to be strictly VF by our Australian standards. This is just my personal opinion and observation, I must stress. I think I sold some of my top grade and rare variety sovereigns to that company a couple of years ago via eBay. Would be interesting to have known what grade they were given by PCGS, no doubt at least some they would have graded higher than what I had purchased them as. I had some superb grade sovereigns and some very rare varieties, some of which only a handful were known according to Downies who I purchased them from. Sorry I sold so many of them, could get at least double price for them now. There is a lesson there people, only sell your gold if you really need to not because it seems like a good idea at the time.
Purple Penny and Drakes have enlightening posts on the Sheldon vs. Adjectival grading. It would seem to be spot on to say e.g., Australian F can get a low VF grade. https://www.drakesterling.com/what-is-pcgs https://www.thepurplepenny.com/articles/pcgs-grading-versus-australian-grading-standards/
Thanks for that graph @jultorsk , very enlightening! At least my suspicions were reasonably close in regards to the lower grade Fine to Very Fine Sovereigns. But it still does nor explain why some Choice Uncirculated MS63 sovereign coins sometimes get downgraded to aUnc by Australian graders if according to the graph they are both at the same level? And I find it a bit confusing that a MS64 coin can be either a Choice Unc, or a Gem Unc coin! Surely it is one or the other, a gem Unc is better than a choice Unc, so it should have a higher numerical grade. Too much confusion and contradiction in the American system IMO, better stick to our Aussie grades I recon.
@hardyakkagold, @jultorsk thanks you both for the considered input, this is a conversation which is often skirted by collectors and certainly taboo in any coin shop in the country. A breath of fresh air! Edit to add > thanks for the link to purple penny jultorsk, I have purchased from them in the past and found their customer service to be spot on.
Premium a little steep, but if it's what you want... https://www.kjc-gold-silver-bullion...e-reverse-gold-sovereign-uncirculated/2206854
That Drakes coin is still there, same price. As it's been hanging there for three weeks already you can always leave a bold offer (shave off fifty etc) - you never know, he doesn't mind to haggle. Toning on that coin looks quite nice. (No, it's not my coin and I'm not affiliated in any way ). https://www.drakesterling.com/1930-perth-sovereign-37908303
