Why are silver coins cheaper than bars?

Discussion in 'Silver' started by TreasureHunter, Jul 31, 2013.

  1. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    just stamp "half a penny" on the bars, then the price would be cheaper than coins.
     
  2. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    The explanation is given there at amsterdamgold.com (and other dealers sites) though.

    - For nonfabricated silver, alike bars, it's the full tax rate of Netherland: 21% so the dealer has to add it to the invoice as a 21% tax item, above his profit, explaining the very high spread (see below)
    So that 21% tax is always there on this kind of silver, only that if you're buying the silver as a business for your business purposes, you can subtract the tax later on from your tax bill (that's always the case for businesses)
    - For fabricated silver, alike coins and bars with a design / face value, the dealer can (he doesn't have to) chose a tax agreement named 'margin', wherein the dealer himself has to pay a reduced tax rate of 6% + eventual import duties when his supplies is foreign, and wherein only tax on shipping appears on the invoice, so the dealers profit AND the tax(+import duties) is included in the product price on the invoice, there is no separate tax item for the silver on the invoice, only for the shipping. The dealer pays tax on his profits too ofcourse.
    https://www.inkoopedelmetaal.nl/nl/
    At the moment,
    - the spot price is 15,02 per ounce which is 483 per kilo
    - a Umicore 1 kg bar costs 646 which is spot price + 33,7% bought back by the dealer (set at 98% of spot) for 473 so spread is 173 per kilo (with a 21% tax component)
    - a Maple Leaf 1 ouncer costs 19,40 which is spot price + 29,2% bought back by the dealer (set at 107% of spot) for 16,05 so spread is 107,7 per kilo
    - a Kookaburra / Lunar / Koala 1 kg coin costs 615,00 which is spot price + 27,4% bought back by the dealer for 511,50 so spread is 103,5 per kilo (with a 6% tax component)
    So the spread on the kg bar is 67% bigger than the spread on kg coin.

    And that's why silver bars are so expensive, when you buy them as a nonbusiness, the spread on silver is worldwide seen already big as a rule - volatile price due to a big part of the demand caused by people that never intended to keep it for a longer time - so dealers take this into account and hedge themselves along a high spread, and on top of that, 21% tax.
    While the coins/coinbars are just 6% tax on top of the spread, but the sell price is still higher than the spread suggests, due to the dealers chosing to divide the spread over selling and buying back (hence the 107% of spot setpoint).
     
  3. PAGAU

    PAGAU New Member

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    I hope Australian Gov't doesn't whack a tax on PM's (bars).

    They targeted Tobacco and Banking, what else is fair game?
    A bigger deficit (propping up the post-GFC economy) means something else will be a 'tax target'...
     
  4. RA

    RA New Member

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    Wha? Where are you finding bars more expensive than coins? In the US it's the opposite, bars are the cheapest way to buy with rounds almost always more pricey because a perfectly round object takes more precision to manufacture than a square object.
     
  5. TreasureHunter

    TreasureHunter Well-Known Member

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    I find bars more expensive in some places, some countries.

    The US and Australia have the best prices on bars.

    The highest prices on everything are in the UK.

    Continental Europe is full of high premiums and high VAT's and other taxes added on top of all silver products, but Estonia is most probably the cheapest - no VAT!

    Some bars are traditionally "too expensive", especially some notorious brand items like Johnson Matthey, Pamp and Valcambi.
     
  6. amar0821ag

    amar0821ag New Member

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    I live in the US...prices in USD
    Provident Metals
    Cheapest generic round 17.30 1.46 over spot
    cheapest generic bar 17.95 2.11 " "

    cheapest 10 oz. bar 16.97/oz. 1.13 " "

    cheapest 5 oz. bar 17.85/oz. 2.01 " "

    Coins running between $19-21 $4+ " "
     

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