What's Your Opinion on Kilo Pandas?

Discussion in 'Modern Chinese Coins & Medallions' started by silverlover, Aug 2, 2011.

  1. silverlover

    silverlover Member

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    I have been reserving on a 2009 kilo panda for $3200 (with box and COA) for awhile and payment times coming. While it's tough to swallow paying a kilo coin for $100/ozwhen silver is at $40 oz, this coin seem a lot to have going for it

    4000 mintage
    Proof finish
    Comes with box/COA to help minimize the chance of counterfeit
    Practically impossible to get in any online shop unless you are willing to pay $150-$250/oz (and they all have been sold for a while)

    Also it seems that Pandas that come in Kilo sizes have a greater demand on it's own just for being that big! Good example are the 5 and 12 oz Pandas.

    Wonder what your thoughts are?
    I consider myself pretty knowledgable in most modern numismatic coins (1990-present kooks, all Lunar years, grizz and wolves, boxed Perth sets, britannias, kangas,etc) but learning the ropes of the Panda market.
     
  2. hiho

    hiho Active Member Silver Stacker

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    I think youre mad, you can buy 80 oz's silver for that
     
  3. THUCYDIDES79

    THUCYDIDES79 New Member Silver Stacker

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    I laughed so much after this one.

    Hello silverlover,


    For $3200 for the ( 2009 Panda 1kg ) you should be able to find 2 1kg Kookaburra coins or as hiho mentioned above 80 oz of bar silver.

    u do the math
     
  4. fishball

    fishball New Member Silver Stacker

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    Depends what you're after really.

    If it's the potential numismatic value of Pandas you're after then buy the panda.

    If it's the ounces which matter to you, buy some plain ugly silver bars instead.

    Personally I wouldn't buy Kilo kooks even if I could get them for cheap, their potential for appreciating in value is pretty low imho.

    Looks like a good buy though.

    If you look at eBay Germany, some of the 5oz/12oz coins go for $6000 US...bloody hell.
     
  5. silverlover

    silverlover Member

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    Hiho

    The same scenario happened less than a year ago. I was thinking about buying a few boxed sets of the ANDA 2 oz colored tiger for almost $100 a piece. I was talked out of it and instead bought the 2010 eagles from bullion direct. I think it was like $25 per coin and I grabbed two rolls. Fast forward today and I would have made out better with the tigers ( I just posted this on Matthews thread). Much better.

    Of course high premium coins don't appreciate like that all the time. But I've been having a good knack lately for picking up really good coins for cheap prices or higher premium coins that have appreciated.

    Most purchases I've been making I never hesitate at all. But this one has really got me nail biting a little bit. Another purchase I made when silver was in the same price range as it is now were the 2007 kangas. Grabbed some from Peters site at $100 per coin and these have been very profitable gems lately. Yes, I could have gotten twice as more silver but I got angry and was happy to make "mad" money. ;)

    I do appreciate the advice nevertheless and still consider it, simply because I lack the knowledge in Pandas.

    Thucydides, like I told Hiho, I appreciate the advice. I have considered getting kilo kooks, which still can be found at still great bargains. Though part of me feels that there might be sooo much of a demand for the kilo Panda that it will outweigh the high cost at today's silver prices.

    Overall guys, while I'm not 100% convinced that I should buy the kilo, i do however feel it wouldnt be too hard to get my money back + extra money if I decided to change my mind. ;)

    Fish ball, thanks for the response. I feel the same as you do and have been through this time and time before. I have limited knowledge in the Panda market and needed some advice. :)

    I recently bought a 2010 silver lunar series I tiger proof for $110. Hopefully my madness didn't require any anger management. :p
     
  6. somerset

    somerset Member Silver Stacker

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    This is a good deal!
     
  7. silverlover

    silverlover Member

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    But I could have bought 2 and a half ounces of generic silver instead! What am I thinking....lol
     
  8. Austacker

    Austacker Active Member

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    Perhaps if you are looking at returns, rather than bullion and you have an interest in Pandas for $3200 would buy quite an assortment of current and older Pandas just be picky and DYODD on the best years to get. I am sure Yennus would gladly help do a deal for you ? Plus I reckon you would end up with a lot more than a Kilo of Silver and get Pandas as well.

    My $0.02c
     
  9. mrslick32

    mrslick32 New Member

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    I think this is a good deal. One thing to remember about pandas is that they should not be treated as bullion coins for pricing purposes (except for the more recent ones like the 2010 and 2011 1 oz. pandas, which have a relatively large mintage). If I may use investment terms, I would consider pandas as a different asset class with a different behavior in terms of potential returns. The reason why I am saying this is that most people who buy pandas with lower mintages are buying them as numismatic items and the demand for them is driven by factors such as relative scarcity, beauty of the design, and condition of the coin, as you have seen with the recent sale of the 5 and 12 oz. pandas in Ebay Germany. The silver content is also a factor but is secondary.

    If you're only after the silver content, I agree with some of the posters here that you are better off buying other bullion coins. But in my opinion, the panda coins are much better for investment purposes than regular bullion coins because of the strong demand for them. In addition, you'll see that the kilo panda looks so nice with its large diameter that you may fall in love with it and not want to sell it anymore. That happened to me when I bought my first 5 oz. panda.

    To illustrate the potential returns of larger size pandas, here is a story from my personal experience. I purchased a 12 oz. panda for my collection for around US$400 in 2009. I was able to sell it for around US$1,300 this year because I wanted to use the money to buy other panda coins that I wanted for my collection. Right now the 12 oz. panda I sold is offered for around US$1,800 in Ebay USA. I must warn you though that as with any investment, the value of panda coins can go up or down. Although the trend has been for them to go up over time, there is no guarantee. The same is true though with the price per oz. of any precious metal.

    These are my 2 cents. :) I hope it helps you make your decision.
     
  10. yennus

    yennus Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Hi silverlover, I think you are onto a bargain that will bring good returns in the near future. I met a wonderful silverstacker who shared his experience with his Pandas. He bought some 2009 1oz Silver Pandas for $19each back in 2009... today those Pandas are worth at least $85-$95EACH. That's a times x4-x5 return in JUST 2 years.

    Today, he has options to play with.
    1. He can either keep them and hope they go up in price even more.
    2. Sell them at 4x-5x return in JUST 2 years.
    3. Swap them for ASEs/Maples/Lunars/etc at a ratio of at least 2x 1oz bullion coins to a 2009 1oz Panda.
    4. Get them graded, and see their price increase even MORE.

    Ignore the usual pandaphobes, they don't know how to see an undervalued asset even when shown the FACTS.

    There is a Chinese proverb: "What is scarce is valued, what is plentiful is not." What you have found is currently scarce... will it be more scarce in the future? The answer is pretty easy.
     
  11. mrslick32

    mrslick32 New Member

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    Very well said.
     

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