Whats happening in Cyprus and what does it mean for silver??

Discussion in 'Silver' started by JoeyJoeJoe, Mar 24, 2013.

  1. Clawhammer

    Clawhammer Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    'Usually' someone on ZH will be posting SLV & GLD volumes.... but for some reason, not this time :/
     
  2. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    It's not that complex to understand absence of price spikes due to this: sales of silver compensated for it.
    The price was originally higher due to some entities/people that bought silver anticipating on other entities/people buying later at higher prices.
    The next step in milking a market, especially for entities that bought alot silver, is trying to sell when alot others buy, because that allows the former to sell most of that silver at a higher price since the sale itself has a downwards price pressure.
    They can sell the first tonnes at ex $29, this sale moves price to $28, then their next tonnes sell at only $28.
    If others buy during this sale, then the price can stay $29, so that they can sell the next tonnes also at that price.

    The best method to watch this happening is along the Comex total position weekly reported on http://www.cftc.gov/dea/futures/other_lf.htm and a graph (the green line) on http://finviz.com/futures_charts.ashx?t=SI&p=w1
    Sometimes they prevent the price from dropping, sometimes they prevent the price from rising, as to encourage buying/disencourage selling at $35, and disencourage buying/encourage selling at $28.

    So, the problem is that you shouldn't assume given silver spot price as real market/stackers-based.
    You have to look at the Comex and even other paper-vehicles positions in order to find out whether it is or is not.
    See, there are more effects on silvers spot price than just Cyprus/whatever specific.

    To give the recent trend of it:

    26/03/2013 24041 $28.85-$28.63
    19/03/2013 26439 $28.70-$29.05-$28.94
    12/03/2013 29423 $28.90-$29.35-$29.19
    05/03/2013 29183 $29-$28.55-$28.69
    26/02/2013 30886 $28.70-$29.35-$29.18
    19/02/2013 37956 $30.10-$29.30-$29.46
    12/02/2013 46797 $30.60-$31.20-$31.10
    05/02/2013 51946 $31.60-$32.10-$31.76

    This is usually the origin of 'weird/unexpected' spot price movements or absences of them.
    The Comex, the place where the systemic entities make silvers price move according to their marketwide global scheme.
    Watching them is knowing which part of the price is bogus.
    Of course, as long as other price affecting factors are stable enough to allow them to be not taken into account.
     
  3. menotcrimex

    menotcrimex Member Silver Stacker

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    These unrealistic lows probably with further lows to come imho of around $1377 US Gold and sub $26.50 US Silver represent urgency / scrambling.

    The manipulators have limited time with gold, it would seem they ( may ) have more time with silver.

    In the end those with physical gold or silver will be very happy indeed.
    When....I don't really know but I hope its this year.
     
  4. Peter

    Peter Well-Known Member

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    Silver maybe $23.go to gold, it's safer.
     
  5. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    The trucks were filmed in Cyprus, when they left the national bank there.
    How the cash was transported to the national bank, was referred to as 'plane or boat'.
    How the paper and cotton (?) arrived at the ECB, I don't know.
     
  6. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    I avoided it because alot in hands of the same that bring us inflation. In my view, it doesn't make sense to try to avoid inflation loss by swapping to another product whoms market and price they also control.
     
  7. Peter

    Peter Well-Known Member

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    Golds down 20 percent, silver's down 40.
    From highs AUD.
    Which would you rather?

    0.
     
  8. Peter

    Peter Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it's difficult.
    I bought early, so I'm still way ahead.

    I actually think they will try to destroy physical gold as an option
    Because it threatens manipulated fiat , before the endgame.

    And so I expect a big fall.And then a big rise.
    Better to sell before the fall, and buy after.
    But will it be available.?
    I don't think so.

    So hang in there people.
    I'm not sure what will happen, but am sure it will be a rollercoaster ride.
    And of all the bets, Golds the surest, but
    not even thats certain.
     
  9. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    It's not like that this matters in a choice, the money for nothing club buys more silver, driving price % more up than gold, then dumps more silver, driving price % more down than gold.
    Happened quite some times in recent years.
    Never noticed it?
     
  10. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    In the 2 years I watch precious metals worlds, for some reason, I always saw this statement around price levels that afterwards turned to be out near of at bottoms.
    So I started to think that some people that already sold in the hope to buy back in lower, needed others after them to attempt this too, in order to bring that lower.

    So too many didn't listen apparently.
    I guess those that sold in 2008 at $9 learnt some lessons.
    And since, some more.

    This illustrates abit the problem, since buying itself pushes up a price, only a certain amount of a product can be bought at those lower prices.
    The more fiatmoney that is held ready to be swapped to the product, the lower the % of it that will succeed to do so at those lower prices and thus the less chance to succeed in buying back lower.
    So this makes it abit funny, the more you see people selling with this intention, the less chance that the lower price level will happen and on success in buying back in there.
    I noticed some months ago that the price dropped 3 dollars due to other than ETF/Comex sales, so likely delivered silver.
    Based on the assumption that the intention behind these sales was the buy back in lower, it means that those 3 dollars may have to be added to the previous bottom price level too.
    And hence I decided to swap my fiatmoney already at $26+$3=$29. So far this thinking path has been abit less than $1 'wrong'. So far. In the end, it's what it is: a speculation based on market data from a certain period. But I think it's better than having no clue at all and gamble.
     
  11. grinners

    grinners Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Gold is money. Silver is (probably) money.

    I know which one I'd rather have when the system explodes :)
     
  12. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    When the event 'system explodes' happens or not, I opt for silver, because I trust current gold holders less than current silver holders. Much less.
    And, they created that system.
    When a company defaults, the remaining property/value is sold to pay as much as possible of the bills the company didnt pay.
    Imagine a company with a big gold stock, that gold being sold. Just 1 scenario. There are others that don't even need such default, lol.
     
  13. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    interest rate on FD 0.1% p.a.

    if your balance is >100k Euros, then chances in Cyprus, 60% hair cut is a certainty.

    so 40% negative return is better than a 60% hair cut.

    1st April, is a fools day.

    buy Pd, Pt, Ag, Au and keep some cash, and make sure your balance in a bank ac is lesser than 100k.
     
  14. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    Buying somethings at a doubled/tripled price is the same as a 50% haircut in case tbe original price returns. The central planning isn't stupid. Manipulation is their job paid by enforcement. What if Cyprus was their little attempt in luring people into paying once again the higher price levels on alot markets, where they sit ready to dump the price once again down to where it came from?
    See, Cyprus is actually a non-event, it's an isle representing a half percent of the EU zone and that includes its 'big to its economy'' banking system.
    Why would bank savers run to precious metals for this? Especially if the general price level barely went +10-20% since 2008, so that production costs of the speculated-upon products didn't follow?
    I'm not disencouraging getting rid of fiatmoney here. But I see enough reason to be very cautious.when considering a run to some products when alot already did it before you, and may sit ready to sell at your expense.
     
  15. Giodor8

    Giodor8 Active Member

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    If anything I think gold is the riskier bet at this stage as it has more downside potential whereas I am personally a lover of silver dips as we are experiencing now. How can you lose if in the end you hold the physical as a kind of insurance poilicy while fiat self destructs.
     

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