The relative price of Silver today and Rome

Discussion in 'Silver' started by Dynoman, Mar 1, 2011.

  1. Dynoman

    Dynoman Active Member

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    I just did a quick calculation:

    Roman soldier Annual income = 1 silver denarius per working day, approx. 1,500 grams of silver per annum.

    Australian soldier Annual income = 8.6 ozt per working day, approx. 69,000 grams of silver per annum.

    Based on the Roman salary the equivalent modern price of silver in today's Fiat should be around $1300 ozt.

    Comments, validation, reasons appreciated.
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    If you look at Silver pricing in the modern market, it makes complete sense :

    [​IMG]

    As you can see, Silver was valued higher back in the day as it was real money to the system.

    We can argue the value of a human life through history being lower than it is in today's politically correct world, but there's no denying the fact the modern devaluation of the white metal on a massive scale is key to this supposed 'imbalance' of wages.
     
  3. Dabloodymess

    Dabloodymess Active Member

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    I think your figure for the 'average' soldier is a bit high. Soldiers on deployment definitely get paid a lot, but I dont think it would be right to use that figure for this calculation.

    On current prices 69 000grams/pa is about 80k.

    http://content.defencejobs.gov.au/pdf/triservice/DFT_Document_PayRates.pdf I would consider an average soldier to be a private on Band 5 pay, as shown in the pay scales chart I linked. A soldier on Private Band 5 pay is on base 50 000+11 000 service allowance, bringing pay before any further allowances to 61k. Its usual for training requiring field time to be done regularly, and this nets the soldier more allowances. There are other allowances as well, and extra money given for those with extra qualifications, but conservatively I would add another 5000 on top of that to allow for miscellaneous allowances, which gives us the figure of ~67k for a soldier in Aus. on normal duties who isnt deployed.

    I like the idea of your calculation though. Im not so sure I agree with the result of it though, seems a bit high.
     
  4. Dabloodymess

    Dabloodymess Active Member

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    double post, sorry.
     
  5. Dynoman

    Dynoman Active Member

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    Interesting, given the global population was only around ten million at the time, it certainly gives argument to the idea of an artificially low silver price in today's market.
     
  6. Dynoman

    Dynoman Active Member

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    I took out the peaks and trough's working on $30 ozt $64.5 k PA. More realistic as Silver is up and down right now. Stabilised for a while there around $30 ozt.

    Even in todays price $33.25 divide 31.10 grams per ozt is $1.06 per gram. = $73 K. Not sure how you arrived at your $80 k ?
     
  7. Dabloodymess

    Dabloodymess Active Member

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    Just my dodgy maths... didnt know my grams in a troy ounce off the top of my head, and made the mistake of just googling grams in an ounce... rookie error :rolleyes:

    Also you definitely took the right approach by averaging it out at $30 ozt.

    I still maintain that there is some kind of logical flaw I cant quite pin down, somethng just doesnt seem right. I mean there are just so many variables comparing yearly wages etc over such a long time. We undoubtedly live better than Romans did.... it could still be possible to live like a Roman soldier did for one denari's worth of silver a day (would really have to look more into what costs they incurred on a daily basis).
     
  8. hyperinflation

    hyperinflation New Member Silver Stacker

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    Another way would be to compare the relative purchasing power then and now:

    Our good friend wikipedia reckons:
    "Estimates of the value of the denarius range from 1.6 to 2.85 times its metal content, thought to equal the purchasing power of 10 modern British Pound Sterling (US$15) at the beginning of the Roman Empire to around 18 Pound Sterling (US$29) by its end (comparing bread, wine and meat prices) and, over the same period, around one to three days' pay for a Legionnaire.[1]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_currency
     
  9. Lord Dragon

    Lord Dragon Member

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    Roman soldiers were originally paid in salt. The word salary comes from the word salarium :)
     
  10. Yippe-Ki-Ya

    Yippe-Ki-Ya New Member

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    Since you're getting technical - which is good by the way - you should compare the net wages, so take off about 1/4 for the Ozzie soldier for his after-tx net pay.
    The Roman soldiers did not pay tax...
     
  11. Yippe-Ki-Ya

    Yippe-Ki-Ya New Member

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    I've looked up the denarius and see that it standardised at around 4.5 grams of silver.
    That is 0.145 Oz (troy ounces)

    This was said to be the pay per working day.
    But lets say they got 1 for every day of the year, including off days, that would mean the annual income for a centurion would be:
    0.145Oz x 365 = 53 Oz silver per year!!

    I've taken the average Ozzie troop's salary at $65 000, but have taken off 25% for tax, which leaves him with: $48 750 per year.
    Taking silver now at $30/Oz
    => avg digger now gets 1 625 Oz of silver per year

    That's about 31 times as much as the Roman soldier measured in silver.

    It would therefore be safe to say - based on this comparison - that silver (at $30/Oz) is currently undervalued by a factor of around 30
    Which would bring a realisitc fiat price in TODAYs dollars to between $900 and $1000 per Oz!

    This matches price predictions of other reputable people i respect...

    So my prediction is $1000/Oz silver in today's currency!!
     
  12. Yippe-Ki-Ya

    Yippe-Ki-Ya New Member

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    Note - if you dont like my "logic" of taking after tax dollars as well as counting 365 days as 'working days' for the centurion, then this would actually bring the current silver price expectation to much higher - probably in the $1500/Oz range...

    So i say to all of you who think it'd be a good idea to sell out and take some profits at around $50/Oz - go for it!!!

    more silver for the rest of us ...

    ;)
     
  13. Dynoman

    Dynoman Active Member

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    The reason you became a Roman Legionnaire was to earn hard currency which was originally the exclusive domain of the military. The Romans didn't intend coinage as a normal currency for the average Roman citizen. So in this somewhat privileged situation you would send some of your salary back to the family and then they would be taxed on their earnings similar to rate payers today. Your military wages also paid for your personal weapons and uniform and often for food other than the most basic field issue. So the soldiers wage became somewhat of a retainer with the proceeds of successful campaigns divided between the combatants according to rank. From what history I have read they got paid salary around 220 days per year, not 365.
     
  14. Lord Dragon

    Lord Dragon Member

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    Also what date are you making these calculations based on? The empire lasted for 1000 years and they did have slight inflation during that time.
     
  15. Clawhammer

    Clawhammer Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    There wasn't the varirty of things to buy back then....
     

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