RAM Floral Emblem Gold Coins Controversy????

Discussion in 'Gold Coins' started by Bear Metal, Dec 9, 2016.

  1. Bear Metal

    Bear Metal Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Hi,

    I have recently purchased a $100 1995 proof Au Floral Emblem Waratah (no box or cert).

    There are a couple different articles about these coins and whether they are 22ct or 24ct, and some state it is indeed 24ct. I also believe the cert says .9999

    I have a precious metals verifier and could not get the coin to pass on any reading, I then did an old school water method of determining specific gravity which the coin came out to be approximately 17.8-18.1SG. It had me worried so I popped in to a local dealer who XRF'd the coin and the reading showed it was definitely NOT 24ct, in fact it was approximately 90.66%Au, 4.11%Ag, 5.23%Cu. Very close to 22ct but not quite. I believe the verifier failed at 22ct due to the silver content in the coin as most 22ct only has Au and Cu.

    Does anyone out there have any information regarding this? There is an article (yet to actually find it) from a Krause book I believe stating it is indeed 22ct, then conflicting articles saying it is 24ct. I have absolutely no doubt the coin is 22ct or very close.

    I have contacted the RAM and am yet to get a reply.

    Pic of actual coin below and some information. The coin looks a lot more brilliant in person. It is actually quite a nice coin.

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  2. serial

    serial Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  3. serial

    serial Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    quote from latest Krause
    KM# 308 100 DOLLARS
    10.37 g., 0.916 Gold 0.3034 oz. AGW, 25 mm. Ruler: Elizabeth
    II Obv: Queens portrait Rev: The Waratah Flower, value below
    Rev. Designer: Horst Hahne
    Date Mintage F12 VF20 XF40 MS60 MS63
    1995 3,000 545
    KM# 308a 100 DOLLARS
    10.37 g., 0.9999 Gold 0.3312 oz. AGW Ruler: Elizabeth II Obv:
    Queens portrait Rev: The Waratah fl ower Rev. Designer: Horst
    Hahne
    Date Mintage F12 VF20 XF40 MS60 MS63
    1995 2,500 PF60 595
     
  4. Bear Metal

    Bear Metal Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    'serial' - Thank you very much for your provided info, I did notice differing pics of the coins with some the waratah, queen and rim to be frosted with the rest of the coin proof finish and some the whole coin with a proof finish although thought a BU version would be completely frosted. The article stating Krause to be incorrect may need more investigation. I have done a bit of searching and there does not seem to be much info about the BU coins being 22ct and proof 24ct. Quite annoying really that the mint would do that for an identical coin with a differing finish.

    I bought this coin from a well respected member of the stacker community who is very willing to remedy the confusion in the sale being described as 24ct.

    Due to the fact it is difficult to use the internet for confirmation about these coins it will just pay for buyers and seller alike to ensure they know what they are selling or buying.

    I appreciate your assistance in this matter 'serial' and I keep learning more and more about pm's with the knowledge of others here.

    Just wondering the Krause book you have, is there a particular one to get that covers most things as there seems to be a few out there or would a few cover most coins? I think it may be a good book to have for referencing to.

    Once again, thanks.

    BM.
     
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  5. serial

    serial Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    I know right , they went full retard with the different metal purities between proof and bu
    I have the 2015 copy of Krause in electronic form and hard copy.
    I actually have a few copies, I am a bit of a hoarder of these things as it is good to track the change in price (if any) and any new info there may be between copies
    always happy to help when I can
     
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  6. dragafem

    dragafem Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    there is 2 different coins.one is $100 FV which 1/3of an oz and the $150 which is 1/2oz of pure gold.Both coins should be 999 gold and proof finish .could be yours a jeweller's copy as it happens with the sovs?
     
  7. Bear Metal

    Bear Metal Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Hi dragafem,

    From the info 'serial' supplied and what I have read on the internet there appears to be 3000 BU $100 coins, 2500 $100 proof coins and 1500 $150 proof coins. The info out there is not much but I think Krause did get it right in this instance.

    I am waiting to hear back from the RAM to hopefully get more clarification. Being such an oldish coin I would have thought this would have come up by now. 'serial' seems to know his stuff though from what I have heard from other members.

    Some info about mintage's but from the errors out there who knows......doesn't contain the purity though....

    http://www.abc.net.au/local/stories/2012/09/20/3594547.htm
     
  8. NaturesProphet

    NaturesProphet Member

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    I have a $100 1997 uncirculated coin which states on the certificate of authenticity:

    Mintage: 3000
    Metal: 22ct (91.6%)
    Mass: 1/3 Troy oz
    Diameter: 25mm
     
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  9. camylopez

    camylopez Member Silver Stacker

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    Unless you know the dealer, dont count 100% on his xrf reading, these can be calibrated to be out a certain percentage.
     
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  10. goldpelican

    goldpelican Administrator Staff Member

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    These coins are a headache. From memory the BU and proof were different purity in the $100 size.
     
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  11. camylopez

    camylopez Member Silver Stacker

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    canadians had a similar 100$ series too, one in 22k and one in 14k real shitty situation as most people couldnt tell as they are the same colour
     
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  12. jultorsk

    jultorsk Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    For additional reference point, Renniks says
    - $100 BU 91.67% gold 8.33% copper 1/3oz gold (diam. 25mm)
    - $100 proof 99.99% gold 1/3oz gold (diam. 25mm)
    - $150 proof 99.99% gold 1/2oz gold (diam. 30mm)
     
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