[PR] Why Pandas Are A Good/Better/Best Investment

Discussion in 'Modern Chinese Coins & Medallions' started by yennus, Jul 14, 2011.

  1. pandamonium

    pandamonium New Member

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    Bullion is breaking out a bit. This will change panda prices too. I started buying bullion, then (4) 9 maples, junk silver, others. Finally got hooked on silver pandas and started collecting 1 1/2 yrs ago. Did the research, sold most of my stuff and bought some good coins. I like the 3.3 oz, 5 oz, and 12 oz silvers now. The nearly year long down prices for pandas is over. Expect lower supply too. An Administrator, for CCF, Chinese Coin Forum, has a ebay sale ending on Sunday. Here is one of the most wanted 5 oz ebay # 130757517683 That should link you to his sale, one of many. Prices are not dropping. Consider buying soon...................
     
  2. SydneySilver

    SydneySilver Member

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    Wonderful thread! Thank you very much!
    I think my next purchase will be some pandas.
     
  3. gcsun

    gcsun New Member Silver Stacker

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    Any tips for determining whether a panda is fake or real?
     
  4. Austacker

    Austacker Active Member

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    The one thing everyone is forgetting is that all anyone here is doing is presenting data and information. You all need to make your own decisions on the source, trust and viability. If you just rely on a word or A person or clip or whatever then, that is your choice.

    I say "even" IF someone does have an agenda, so what who doesn't. It then comes back to your decision. If you decide to go in blind that is your choice. If you decide after all of your research still not to go in that again is fine as well. I don't recall anyone holding a gun to someone's head and saying you must buy this.

    I must say that to single out an individual who has offered up information for FREE, researched and backed up. With a quality product to match was not right, nor was it justified. However I don't believe the intention was that way, well I hope not. If you have any doubt about the quality just have a look at the quantity returns of OMP bears returning a MS69/MS70 grades purchased from this forum from a few sellers. Plus I have never, ever, ever had one push from this person to buy a product, not once. Just further information, details and definitely no pressure.

    That to me says no one has an agenda. You purchase when you are happy to purchase. If you felt your dealings with this person was different and you were pressured and misled. You should take that up, however I am not sure if you have ever purchased anything from him either ? If you don't want Panda's as he said, he has a lot of ASE's to move at a good price. Give it a go good service and a great guy. Not dissing or wanting to bring up old mud BTW.

    I have made my decision, wrong, right or stupid who knows. I will tell you how it goes in a few years. However this was my decision based on information I have. I have no one to blame or point the finger at, bar me. However if it goes half as good as planned I know I will have a few key people to thank.

    Keep the information flowing for all to make their own decisions. Oops Sorry I may have an agenda to sell my rare panda's now :D
     
  5. yennus

    yennus Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  6. chrissilver

    chrissilver Member Silver Stacker

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    Thanks for this thread. Very interesting. I have been stacking more in favour of the kooks as they have lower mintages, but I do see that previous year Pandas, even with their ridiculously high mintage are doing quite well.

    So now I think it is time to start stacking some pandas as well :) As soon as I have saved up some monies I am going to start filling up some air-tit tubes with lovely Pandas :)

    I am not going to stop stacking Perth Mint coins. And the majority of my stack will still be Perth Mint. But I think it's wise to add a few Pandas in there too. :)

    Pandas are also some of the most beautiful coins in my opinion. Which will always help demand in the future.
     
  7. AnnieSOhara

    AnnieSOhara New Member

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    According to me panda is a good investment, pandas are also having the ups and downs like other investment. From last two years I have seen that it is best and profitable to invest in panda coins.
     
  8. hihosilveraway

    hihosilveraway New Member

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    I avoided buying silver pandas due to the counterfeits out there. Bought a double sealed 2010 panda in FL at a coin shop only to find out it's a damned good counterfeit. Only found out by doing research on panda-feits. But now I am keeping it alongside a genuine 2010 silver panda, to show to coin shop dealers...no one can tell the difference even with eye magnifiers. What got me started 18 months ago buying silver pandas were some strokes of luck: a 1990 small date at an antique mall for $40, a 1989 at a coin shop in Pittsburgh for $60, a 1991 large date at a local coin shop for $60 and a 2000 frosted panda at another coin shop for $50. I also got a 1993 three-coin set (mint, proof, and copper panda) for $200 at an jewelry store in my neighborhood, probably an estate sale item. At any rate, I decided at that point to get these pandas certified by NGC. Fortunately, my local coin shop dealer offers to ship to NGC for about $18 per silver panda. The amazing thing was that all these pandas came back MS69 except for the 1993 proof at MS68 and the red copper panda at MS66. After that, I decided to try for a complete set of mint pandas 1989-2015, all certified by NGC. I am just about finished, but it has cost me. Found a couple of MS70s at a coin show, one MS69 at a local coin dealer, and the rest on eBay. I am of the opinion that these certified pandas will not go down in value, and having at least one coin from every year helps the investment. My question to the forum is this: should I spring really big bucks for the 1987 and 1983-85, or wait for some serendipitous sale from an estate or very very nice seller, at which point I will click the proverbial silver slippers (see the book version of Wizard of Oz or YouTube videos on this topic)...
     
  9. KeepOnTrying!

    KeepOnTrying! Member

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    Great job with what you have achieved so far! I am not as lucky as you; two local coin fairs I visited did not have any MCC!!!

    The answer to your question depends on how deep your pocket is. There are a few graded and ungraded 1983-1985 sets on eBay (last time I checked). PF68s are fine and PF69s will cost more but are worth the cost. There is going to be a time when those coins will disappear completely from the market, as new well heeled collectors hit the market.

    Some people say that you do not need the first three years' coins in a set but I believe that having the complete set from 1983 onwards magnifies the value of your set.

    Regarding your comment, one of the first things about fakes is that they tend to be cheap! Buying NGC and PCGS certified and slabbed coins is probably the best way of acquiring especially early year pandas. Also buy from reputable eBay sellers. eBay has a no quibbles return policy. More sophisticated collectors (not me!) have sensitive weighing scales, calipers, computer microscopes and other tools of the trades they use in examining thier newly purchased coins.

    Goodluck!
     
  10. KeepOnTrying!

    KeepOnTrying! Member

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    Also see my comments in Post#69 below. Thanks.
     
  11. Silverdale

    Silverdale Active Member

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    I notice not many pandas are being sold on this site is that because they don't sell
    Or because no one wants to sell any thoughts
     
  12. Silverdale

    Silverdale Active Member

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    Hard to argue with any of that all great points. Probably sums it nicely
    Seems a shame not to see more out there as they such beautiful coins
     
  13. JNS

    JNS Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Panda still one of many coins in my collection, in a long run, there are a lot of coins now a days to profit with. Unless you are really a collector. I never sold any panda coin in my stack since i started collecting.
     
  14. Silverdale

    Silverdale Active Member

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    Same I buy them when they come up I never sell any or have any intention to sell
    I like your style
     
  15. yennus

    yennus Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Usual principle: Pandas go where they are loved the most.

    There was a time that China mostly exported Pandas... but now I think the pendulum has swung, and China is repatriating their bears.
     
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  16. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    hi can your provide links for coins store in your area that post international? thanks
     
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  17. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    people are still buying the 30g silver panda coins
    some people stack them by the box
    those past years are flying back to the panda mountains to retire
     
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  18. barsenault

    barsenault Well-Known Member

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    They’re good to stack IF the price is right. With 10 million of these bad boys being minted, I highly doubt you’ll see substantial premiums over the longer term. They’ll do okay, but not great, like the early issues before millions were printed...oops, I mean minted. But I do get my 1 or 2 trays every every year. I’d have to imagine the early years 1983 - 1990’s will have to increase in value as the mintage for the modern pandas goes from 10 million to 15, 20, 30 million a year. Glad I have a set of 69’s of the big 3 1983 - 1985. They weren’t cheap, but hopefully worth it over the long term.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
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  19. SlyGuy

    SlyGuy Active Member

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    Opinions are nice, but try researching your opinions before you go too heavy into putting them in action. That's what every youtube or printed review of a coin or basically every post in this thread is: simply an opinion. You know what they say about opinions: "opinions are like ... ; everyone's got one, and they all stink."

    ...at the end of the day, gold is gold and silver is silver. You are only guaranteed the face value or spot value, nothing more. Personally, I might pay 5-10% premium over spot for increased liquidity of a govt coin or for something I really like the look of, but the premium ("numi") value is hardly ever recouped. Often, the premium is nearly all lost. Most dealers simply buy coins brought to them for 90-100% spot, possibly a hare more for govt coins in a good market. eBay might get you a bit over spot price, but then you pay 13% plus insured shipping (and still have the chance of buyer claiming scam and that they never received coins).

    I always suggest people try selling coins before they do a lot of buying. You don't have to go through with the sales, but at least test the market well. When you sell your stack, rounds are rounds and govt issue might be rounds + 3%. More likely, govt issue are valued the same as rounds... but with better chance the shop or ebay ppl will want to buy them at all. The govt minting vs private mint just seems to add in a tiny bit of buyer trust. Govt issues will likely sell easily nearly all of the time (esp in their native country), but rounds and foreign coins are only easy and quick sells in a hot market. That's just a fact...



    Exactly, but don't forget they are 30grams also. If you want to make money, then buy rounds at or near spot. If you want good liquidity and to hopefully make money, buy any major govt coin that is on best sale (ASE, philharm, kanga, maple, lib, brit, panda, etc etc).
    It is key to remember than silver and gold pandas are 30grams and not 1ounce aka 31.1gram of the precious metal like the rest of govt coins... that often does matter to their value on the back end. It needs to be taken into account, especially when making an offer on a large quantity. For me, maples are usually the cheapest govt minted coins in USA... but I will take any govt coin that people are selling cheaply or accepting my eBay offers on. I generally do find pandas to be the most problematic because of the different weight, though - for both buying or selling.

    ...If you want pretty coins, then you can obviously buy whatever you want. Just remember what a huge marketing industry numi coins are ("limited edition," "anniversary," "gem mint," "privy," "first strike," etc etc). You need to consider that those are the main money makers for the mints (and therefore the main money losers for buyers). Small fortunes go into advertising these coins, giving people free ones to make a youtube "review" about them, coming up with clever marketing ideas, etc. I'm not saying that's necessarily a deal breaker, but to think that because a coin is good looking or low mintage or blah blah will mean it holds or gains on the premium you pay over spot is foolish. Again, try being a seller and find out for yourself. GL
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
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  20. barsenault

    barsenault Well-Known Member

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    Hi there. Yes indeed, silver is silver and gold is gold. BUT, paint is paint, and canvas is canvas. Yet paintings go for millions of dollars. Nuts right? It’s just paint on a canvas. So, in many ways, I agree with you about stacking silver. Get the cheapes possible, which I do - at times. Actually, I have an ownx account for that reason. Stack cheap, and a lot of ounces, so when it comes time to sell, I hit a button, and I can take delivery (which I’ve done numerous times), or take cash (which I’ve done numerous times) or roll into gold when the GSR goes to 40 (which I haven’t done yet). All at the hit of button, whether I have 1 ounce or 10,000 ounces. There have been many instances where I bought high premium bullion coins and have done quite well, and sold easily (2017 swans as example). But there are many other examples too, where I bought at high premium coin and flipped and done very well. Another example are the southern sky dome 1 oz gold, in at 1500.00, and sold quite a few at a good profit.

    I can go on and on with success that I’ve had buying high premium coins and flipped and done great. Of course I happened to.buy low and sell high...but some of those I sold went even higher and have stayed there (swans as an example). There are many different strategies to invest in PM’s and one size doesn’t fit all. I know folks who have an eye for collectibles, and make a fortune buying and selling these. What about the Ares Gods series? 200.00 buy in, now selling for 1500 or higher. There is example after example after example of folks doing very well buying high premium coins. I have many different approaches to investing in the PM sector. I’m not saying all my purchases have been mega profits when I go to sell, but I’d say most have done just fine, even with the expensive premium and ebay fees. A newbie needs to first dabble in this space and find out what best suits him or her. If it is to simply play the spot price, then yes, get lowest silver over spot and stack as much as possible. But there are definitely different approaches and strategies to buying, selling and collecting in this universe call PM’s.

    Actual sales Ares (sadly I didn’t buy any)
    https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...sop=12&_dmd=1&_ipg=200&LH_Complete=1&_fosrp=1

    Actual sales 2017 swans (got these at 24.00)
    https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_od...swan+b.TRS0&_nkw=2017+silver+swan+bu&_sacat=0
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
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