Bron, one query. Will an existing holding of unallocated silver be transferred to a 'Pool Allocated' form (with the associated charges etc) or will it remain as unallocated with a different charge structure?
ummm.... with SMSF you pay capital gains tax every year on unrealised profits - just as if you had in fact sold everything at the current market value as at 30 June 20xx This differs from when you hold PM in your private capacity where you only pay CGT on a sale/swap. This is one of the disadvantages of super tax law - i.e. that you pay taxes with REAL CURRENCY on phantom profits ... The only upside is that its "only" 15% ... But still, it is a joke really, because if your SMSF stack grows quite large, you may find that your phantom "profits" in a given tax year are more than the amount being paid into your SMSF for that particular year at which point you'll have to liquidate some PMs just in order to meet the tax bill on your phantom gains - which = increase in value over that given tax year - whether you've sold anything OR NOT! Lovely tax system we have dont you think??
And a comment now that I've had a quick look at the referenced goldismoney2 thread. Firstly, our forum is pretty sane comparatively. Secondly, Peter Schiff's letter is well put. Thirdly, do people not realise both refinery and mint operations require physical to operate? Logically, the suggestion that the refinery or mint holds paper is ludicrous. Paper does not refine into metal. Paper does not mint into coin. Finally (to paraphrase slightly): is just wonderfully put.
I believe what you have just said is incorrect, AFAIK (which has been discussed before) you only pay tax when you realise the gains (ie. when you sell). I can sit on the PM's until I retire, why should I be paying tax each year on them when I have no intention to sell them until retirement. Isn't it the same with shares? you pay tax when you realise the gains? Slam
Clients currently holding Unallocated silver will stay that way with no storage charge. There is no swap going on. You just won't be able to add to your existing Unallocated. If you want to buy more silver, it will have to be either Pool Allocated or Allocated.
Looks like this may be changing after all - in the future. The blog publishing of this letter has revised some of the wording: So unallocated gold might be going as well one day.
More info on this at http://www.perthmintbullion.com/Blo...ed_Silver_Storage_To_Replace_Unallocated.aspx And as to the question about $50,000, that is total account value (ie gold + silver)
I have been paying tax on the annual value increase my PM's have risen in my SMSF, without selling them.
Don't own property through SMSF yet, but does the same apply? CGT on the property valuation every year?
What if they go down in price? I believe you only need to provide an annual valuation to ensure your not doing anything dodgy on the SMSF, but to actually pay tax on the paper gains is absurd. Do you get a refund back if goes down in value and you cash out at retirement? I'll ask my brother, his an accountant and I'll post back. Slam
What? CGT is payable when a CGT event occurs (i.e. Sale of asset). Where is the CGT event here? http://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/content.asp?doc=/content/00237979.htm&page=10&H10
I could be wrong, but I do not believe that it is termed as CGT on the annual return, just as an ordinary tax.
maybe you are being taxed for some other component or contribution to super... its like having an investment property. i don't see how you need to pay cgt each year on it...
I don't see how you'd need to either. I guess you could do it voluntarily and pay tax in years when the price of the asset has risen and claim a deduction in the years when the price of the asset has fallen, but that would be a lot of rather pointless work when the idea behind CGT is you just pay tax/claim a loss when you dispose of the asset.
I can assure you that it is not voluntary. But at issue here is that the annual tax is, in all probability, not a CGT, but nevertheless a tax.
