panda tolerances

Discussion in 'Modern Chinese Coins & Medallions' started by samboyellowsub, Jul 20, 2011.

  1. samboyellowsub

    samboyellowsub Member

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    I bought my first two silver pandas today. a 2004 and 2007. Everything looks exactly like it should. One is in a sealed capsule that doesn't look like it would open easily. The other (2007) is in a capsule that has a little divot in the side about the size of a finger nail. I opened that one and weighed it. Only 31.01 grams (478.4 grains). Is this acceptable? It measures 40.05 - 40.1 mm across. From many detailed pictures on the web, all the details look perfect (size of date, denomination, text font and placement, panda bear details). Just wondering. I'm not going to try to open the sealed one.

    edit: also, on the coin that i removed from the capsule, noticed that the thickness appeared to vary slightly as I rotated the coin looking at the reeding (which is slanted on both coins btw). upon further inspection, i noticed that it looked like a little extra thin silver that was forced to the side of the die as the planchet was struck. should i try to capture this in a picture?
     
  2. THUCYDIDES79

    THUCYDIDES79 New Member Silver Stacker

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    I am assuming you have calibrated the scales and stuff.
     
  3. samboyellowsub

    samboyellowsub Member

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    only with a few other 1 ounce rounds ... (edit) and a 5 gram pamp suisse bar (showed 5.00 grams)
     
  4. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    yes
     
  5. samboyellowsub

    samboyellowsub Member

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    sorry, will have to wait on the pictures. the wife has misplaced the camera data cable. in the meantime, are the other measurements sound? I used a set of Browne & Sharpe metric calipers (pretty precise instrument).
     
  6. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    sorry a response took so long, I had to look for my calipers - my wife had been using them to measure a very small thing :p

    Right, got my calipers out and a 2007 Panda, I don't have the best eyesight, but mine read spot on 40mm. Put it on my el-cheapo digital scales and got spot on 1 troy ounce, 31.2g (my scales only read to 0.1 g of a gram so if it was 31.15g it would round up (which is more than 1 troy ounce if you convert it it manually?). Peter Anthony says pandas weigh 31.1g, but obviously there's room for error - how much I don't know. Other places I've read have the average at 31.15 - 31.17 (which is closer to 31.2g) so I'll believe Peter Anthony first over any one else.

    Your panda is lighter by about 0.1 grams, that's only 0.32% out. This seems to be in line with tolerances for other modern coins +-0.4% it's getting close, but still in range.

    The diameter is off apparently - don't know anything about that though, whether that's a problem or not, have you checked it's thickness? The thickness varying slightly as you rotated the coin could be a play of light caused by the angled reeding, mine looked to vary as I turned it too, but it was just the light. Or it could be the result of a dodgy planchett - do they mistrike pandas?

    This is all I know, I noticed your thread on another forum and had seen you hadn't as yet got much of an answer. This probably hasn't helped. Peter Anthony (Pandacollector) is a memeber of this forum and visits every so while - why not PM him?

    These have been my random thoughts samboy, hopefully someone for certain will answer the question. If you get one, post it here. You could try joining this forum: http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php and asking the same question.
     
  7. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    So what did you find out samboy?
     
  8. yennus

    yennus Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Yeah, a decent pic would go a long way in this situation :)
     
  9. Pandacollector

    Pandacollector Active Member

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    A Troy Oz. is 31.103 grams (just Googled it to check that my memory hasn't gone soft) so I usually just say 31.1 grams for coins as coin weights aren't precise out to thousandths of a gram.

    Best wishes,
    Peter Anthony
    http://www.pandacollector.com
     
  10. samboyellowsub

    samboyellowsub Member

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    Ah, the camera cord was left at the inlaws' house. Finally have the pictures here. All the pictures are taken through plastic except the 2007 panda (panda side).


    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5974.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5973.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5972.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5971.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    I know the carpet details are a giveaway a lot of the times so here is a close up of one of them (steps look identical on both coins so only one pictured)
    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5976.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    These last two pictures illustrate (to the best of my abilities) the funny part of the reeding that I was talking about.
    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5959.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]

    [imgz=http://forums.silverstackers.com/uploads/1061_img_5954.jpg][​IMG][/imgz]
     
  11. yennus

    yennus Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Yep, they look pretty kosher to me :)

    But if you're concerned there's a whole community over at the china-mint forum that would be happy to help also:

    http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php
     
  12. lionfishcoin

    lionfishcoin Member

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  13. mrslick32

    mrslick32 New Member

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    If I may share my thoughts, I do not recommend opening the capsule because the coin might be damaged if mishandled, which could decrease the coin's marketability when you decide to sell it. In addition, silver coins may develop white spots when exposed to air and white spots may lower the value of your coins.

    I weigh my panda coins with the original mint packaging. Based on my experience, the weight will be anywhere between 1.18 troy ounces to 1.26 troy ounces, depending on several factors such as the weight of the capsule and if the coin also has a plastic seal. The capsules don't weigh the same in my experience. I'm not sure how to convert 0.18 to 0.26 troy ounces to grams so I apologize although I believe that Google has some online converters. I won't be concerned about a small margin of error either. Nothing in this world is perfect and even if the coin weighs exactly 1 troy ounce (31.1 grams), you can never be sure that your scale is accurate to the last decimal place even if it is calibrated.
     

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