Im pretty sure this will have been covered before but has anyone looked at the coin section on the alibaba web site. Absolutely horrifying every thing you can imagine ASE, Maples, Morgans, Philarmonics ect even 1999 kooks and 1938 crown ( I could go on ). All clearly marked as being comprised of base metals and available in bulk for around $.50 us each. Ok so they are marketing them as replicas so not sure where they stand legally but surely there must be a massive amount of these being pumped into system via ebay. Makes me wonder what future holds when trying to sell silver in the future not to mention my current stack although im pretty confident mine are legit due to my sources
Yes, it's been covered but it's always a good reminder to be mindful when buying physical silver these days. The fakes are getting better all the time and some are even fooling some experts. It's legal in China to sell them and eBay forbids fakes to be sold...the difficulty is of course, that anyone can claim they didn't know it was fake. The only way eBay can prove is if they can get a hold of any sales records from the seller which shows they bought from a source which sells them as imitations....but good luck with that. And what if a dealer buys silver products from ordinary people as most dealers do and a large portion of that turns out to be very well made fakes??? Are all the dealers going to take the time to authenticate tens of thousands of ounces of silver before purchasing? I don't know the answer. Bottom line, the fakes are causing a headache for many stackers and collectors. . .
maybe we need to stop using ebay altogether and bullion dealers issue a certificate of authenticity with purchases, its going to be very difficult to sell on secondary market unless we can do something similar I still think encapsulated coins could have a tamper proof seal on them of some sort. I agree with you about the quality though I would never be able to tell difference just by looking at one.
Honestly, technology which quickly & accurately assays the exact composition is the industry's only hope. And fortunately, such products are now out there. Still, would love to see the price come down to like $100 USD or something, so it's affordable to all. I have confidence we'll get there as the industry matures. In the meantime, buyer beware!
eBay is a great marketplace and I don't see how anyone can think they are safeguarded from buying fakes just because they avoid eBay. I have saved lots of money shopping on eBay with reputable dealers/sellers for genuine products. There's no sensible reason I can think of to not shop on ebay at all for silver products. . .
Ref technology to weed out the fakes, I have no doubt cheap versions of this technology will be available very cheaply and it will not be that far off - the Chinese will copy the technology and start selling it cheaply on ebay and alibaba.
Very true. Just don't discount the fact that eBay can also be a dumping ground for these fakes. I've seen some questionable stuff out there. Keep in mind, too, that for the legit places, eBay is almost like a form of advertising for these guys. Oftentimes if you take the extra step, ordering directly from their main site, instead, can be cheaper than through their eBay listings.
Sometimes the specials they run on eBay are not on their main site. Sometimes they offer free ship on eBay (to improve the rank of their listing etc) but not on their main site. There's many possible reasons why I sometimes prefer eBay rather than the dealer's site. Besides, many products are available through eBay and nowhere else. And yes, I am careful when ordering on eBay. If the pm detector technology becomes affordable enough some day, I will buy it. .
Am I the only one who can see what is going on? These fakes are allowed and encouraged to be made and sold because common people started stacking lots in case of a money failure! By the common market being flooded with fakes it makes silver and gold non trade able between common people. Money no good? I will swap you a shiny silver coin for your loaf of bread! "Is it real silver"? "I dont know I will have to find a silver stacker to test it" " Dont bother I will swap my loaf of bread for this mans daughter"
If silver gets better you might start to see 50 cent a coin/bar xrf tests at LCS, maybe even filming them for proof and adding YouTube links in forum posts. I think the trick will be trust and ratings on the forum, things will get out real quick if someone is passing fakes (which they might have bought in good faith ascend so either they make good a refund or quickly get jumped on as frauds). It can muddy the water a bit though, someone sells a real coin, buyer claims it's fake and sends back a fake, seller says this isn't the coin I sent...who to believe? I suppose buyer reputation is important too. F2F meetings at local meets might get more popular, everyone sees what coin was actually traded and maybe even test it. I like the idea of something good coming out of this like more stacker meets and bringing the community a little closer together.
yeah those in the know might have some level of protection but an aweful lot of less informed are going to get burned badly I fear
Fakes are par for the course. Fakes are nothing new...people have been making fakes and imitations for at least 100 years. What we are seeing today is that the technology is such that more and more of the fakes have become so well made that they are sometimes indistinguishable from the real product (unless you have it tested with pro equipment or unless you are a true expert you may not realize it). What some mints have done, are put security features right in the coin. The most obvious example is the RCM with the new 2014 1 oz silver bullion maple leaf. I haven't heard of any fakes surfacing of these coins. Maybe a few years down the road we may see convincing fakes of these but then in a few years, mints can devise new foils against the companies that create the fakes. .
Can you point out the RCM maple security feature. I am new here and have only bought 2014 maples so not sure what it is as I have nothing to compare it to.
