Yeah but to buy these you are playing into the Perth Mints hands. Pumping out extra coins that will not hold the premium like the 300k ones that make the set. The 300k coins are the main game, all the rest are distractions for your money.
WOW I cant believe the perth mint would circumvent the 300,000 mintage on the 1 oz coins, these look pretty cool but that just seems somewhat dishonest to me . I hope they dont start playing all their fixed mintages this way. Why even have a fixed mintage.
Looks like the complete number of 200.000 pcs was made and bought by the German Landesbank "Bayern LB" Made for german market. Bayern is a state in germany and has a lion in his flag. If thats all true, i think they will have a lot of work to sell all these dragons. In my opinion its not worth to pay 1cent more premium than for a ASE.
Such a shame. They are really ruining the collector's market. Re-releasing the red back overseas, a million different versions of dragons, re-minting past year releases and now an extra 200,000 coins over the supposed 300,000 mintage. What's the point of having a mintage limit? I like Perth Mint coins and their quality is world class but don't they realise that they are only hurting themselves? They might be making more sales now but the future might be a different story if they keep this up.
What annoys me most is that the PM claimed they don't have enough production capacity to make the 1/2oz, 2oz and 5oz dragons in the past half year, but they clearly have enough capacity to make all this other stuff.
They have the production capacity I dare say, they just dont have the infrastructure . e.g. the coin engraving moulds/ prints
I wouldn't mind just one for the set, I think that the array of coins is enough to make a collection of the different dragons interesting, the sizes shapes and colours etc. Sure they are destroying the secondry market but they don't make any money on the secondry market anyway. I think that this will have limited appeal but should help those who were unable to get the originals. they are different enough I think for the originals to hold their value and let other people who were late to the party join in. I hate the fake rareity manufactured by the companies, the dragons should sell on their own merit, not just because only a few were made and even fewer were able to be bought in a certain area. Anyway, if anyone gets one please let me know, I am aiming on building a lidded display case to house the different varieties with space below to hold all the original display boxes and certificates, however with the patchy availability, vast amount of worldwide product and the lack of standard issue sizes it will be a few years before I can lay it out. Then I am going to stop. It is a good job snakes are boring to look at.
i dont get the demand for privy marks. they are irrevant to the coin and look sh1t, destroying any design purity the coin may have had.
By the way, silber-corner.de works like this: They have a batch of coins at a certain price, once they sell out the next batch will be more expensive. So while it is EUR 34.49 now, I bet the price will go up very soon. I think in x years time the privy ones are probably same price or more than the normal dragons. Particularly if they sell much fewer than 200,000.
From the wiki... A privy mark was originally a small mark or differentiation in the design of a coin for the purpose of identifying the mint, moneyer, or some other aspect of the coin's production or origin, for control purposes. Nowadays it is mainly used as a design and marketing feature. How true! It serves no purpose other than to enable the mint to circumvent their own guidelines. How convenient!
I know the local coin dealer is not selling any of the PM or RAM Numismatic ? releases now. They are gradually selling all stock and keeping standard Numismatics and Mint Sets, but I believe that is it. Things like Dragons, Ships, Cars, Trains and everything in between they are dropping. It was also only recently I saw a thread were the British Mint got called out on mark up and selling what the dealer said was worthless and couldn't even get what you paid back after 12 months, so not a good investment. I think that says a lot for this release of massive Bullion / Collectors market. From what I can tell it takes about 10-20 dud releases to get something with a bit of interest. It is too hit and miss with what will be hot and what won't be hot. I am out of 99% of this stuff. However what I did get seems to have done me well.
^^^ Agreed. But there must be enough buyers (suckers) purchasing the various coloured proof series the Perth Mint pumps out or they wouldnt be making them ?
lol at comment #2: David.M. says: I checked that link, about the Lion privy Dragon coin. If there's another 200,000 1oz silver dragons being released exactly the same as the 300,000 sold out version except for the privy, I will be very unhappy and feel duded.
^^ there's probably many who supported the Perth Mint's 1oz Dragon program at $70+ a coin who will feel stolen from by this privy deal. But the Perth Mint's attitude has been apathetic with a view of -> we make em, ship em to the distributors and from there nothing to do with us. That kind of attitude doesnt fly with other companies that market and protect their trademark products. Fortunately it looks like the Canadian Mint has got their act together and my money (piddly though it is) has been on buying the wildlife series.
Seems there's a few comments come through on the Perth Mint's site. Give them credit I suppose, they do allow negative comments about their products to be published. Rbaggio says: Hi, can you comment on this: http://www.silber-corner.de/index.php?page=product&info=1098 Is it true that an additional 200,000 1oz silver Dragons are about to be released onto the market? February 16 2012 David.M. says: I checked that link, about the Lion privy Dragon coin. If there's another 200,000 1oz silver dragons being released exactly the same as the 300,000 sold out version except for the privy, I will be very unhappy and feel duded. February 16 2012 Bullion Baron says: I agree David, I will feel ripped off if the 200,000 mintage is accurate. In late 2011 Ron Currie said the following in regards to minting extra 1oz bullion coins: "Throughout the course of the first 12-year Australian Lunar bullion coin series and also during the second 12-year series, 1oz releases have been limited by mintage: 30,000 gold and 300,000 silver. As well as investors, these mintage quotas have also attracted collectors to the series. To increase mintages of 1oz coins during a particularly popular year could be interpreted as opportunistic and possibly damage our credibility as a Mint." http://www.perthmintbullion.com/Blog/Blog/11-09-05/Temporary_Suspension_Of_Silver_Dragon_Orders.aspx While the Privy coin could be considered a new design (technically) I feel that it's a copout for those who have purchased the bullion 1oz thinking no more would be minted and now they've thrown on a small change and nearly doubled the mintage?? Why not just mint more 1/2oz, 2oz and 5oz bullion Dragons? Clearly there is the demand... My hope is that 200,000 was a typo... February 16 2012 Privy Marked says: Know what, I have decided to sell my 2012 dragons when the buy back prices allow me to break even. February 16 2012 S.D. says: The mintage of 1oz 2012 dragons in various versions thus far: Bullion 300,000; Proof 5,000; Proof (from 3 coin sets) 1,000; Coloured proof 10,000 Gilded 50,000; Typeset (4 x 1,500) 6,000 Coloured 9 typeset (for China) 20,000 Berlin Coin Show 5,000 Privy 200,000 (?) That is a lot of dragons.... February 16 2012 David.M. says: I understand there were to be the usual gilded, proof and coloured versions of the 2012 Dragon as there are every year, each is quite different from the bullion version. But this privy coin is EXACTLY the same as the 300,000 minted bullion version just with a lion privy added. This makes me mad that 200,000 of these will be minted. Had I known they were going to be sold for about $45 a coin I wouldn't have bought the 1oz Dragons from the Perth Mint's authorised distributor at the end of last year for $85 each !!! February 16 2012 C. F. says: ...and once all these 200,000 pieces of Lion privy Dragons have been sold out, will we see another 200,000 pieces of Dragons sporting some other animals?
I like this line from the second last comment on their site: "Had I known they were going to be sold for about $45 a coin I wouldn't have bought the 1oz Dragons from the Perth Mint's authorised distributor at the end of last year for $85 each !!!" Gold Jerry, GOLD !
The more I think about it the more of an outrage it becomes. I cant believe they can just mint another 200,000 by changing a small detail, the color dragons or gilded are one thing but this is just downright dirty. I assume they will be doing this with the horse and snake if they are popular which will make me think twice about how many I buy and at what price. I really do feel bad for all the people that spent $ 80-$100 on the 1oz dragons from gouging distributers because they thought the mint would keep its promise of the 300,000 mintage. It could be argued that it is a different coin but then whats next another 500,000 dragons with the same design and a pinpoint privy.
If the Perth Mint was going to be honest with its customers (there's a leap of faith but stay with me), at the commencement of a Lunar year around August they would say upfront what variants they were minting and how many. That way people would be able to judge how many and of which type they would want to buy. But as we've said before, the Mint has no interest in being upfront, just craven that if they see an opportunity to make a quick buck banging out a tiny variant into the market then they will.
I think any knock-off, privy mark Dragons minted IN SUCH LARGE NUMBERS will, over time, be frowned up by collectors. The 1oz bullion is where it is at. You can collect sets of these. I can see future sales in the Buy/Sell forum wanting to sell "1oz Dragons", and the first response will undoubtedly be, "It's not the privy, is it? Just checking?"
