I know Perth mint mentioned that they would go back and mint more of the Lunar II kilo coins and they took the mouse 1 ounce up to the 300k limit, but did they say anything about minting the other sizes with no mintage limits, 1/2, 2, 5, and 10oz or the 1/2kg? One other question, what would you expect current pricing is for a 10 oz Lunar II tiger? Thanks for the help.
I'll bring your attention to this, as we were having a little discussion about the dragons and what's up with 2 of the bigger Perth Mint dealers in the US. http://www.bullionstacker.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=6336 thoughts? ***edit*** yesterday, apmex and gainesville had the 2oz at $135, 5 oz at $330 minimum and the 10oz was $390, tonight (here) they both dumped the prices to $95, $250 and $330 respectively, so I'm asking you if you think they got some news from the Perth Mint that they can expect massive inventories and sell what they have? Are these things going to get pumped out in a big time way???
2oz, 5oz dragons are both unlimited mintage until the snake comes around in September or afterwards. Perth Mint said they would restart production or something in January so there will most likely be a flood of them on the market pretty soon. Not surprised they're dropping prices slightly to shift them now before that happens.
No, those sizes wont be minted again and the Dragon minting of those sizes will cease in about September when production of the snake begins.
Isnt there anti-cartel or anti price fixing laws in the US ? These 2 companies list coins for the SAME price and on the SAME day several months later they drop the prices by the SAME amount....
Yes there are anti-collusion laws, but proving collusion is next to impossible. Kind of like proving the big 4 on Comex are colluding to manipulate the price of precious metals. Honestly, they'd both (apmex and gainesville) like to believe they are market leaders, but all they did was follow the European dealers pricing. I find it kind of funny that Apmex made a big deal about offering anyone that pre-ordered odd size dragons 1pc of 1oz dragon at $99.99 before they listed them on their website, like they were doing us a favor. Then those 4000 or so they had after that sat on there until about 2 weeks ago when they dropped the price to $85 and now they're down to $80. At those prices they're going to enjoy looking at them for a long time. They'll drop the prices another couple times by $5 per drop and find a spot where they sell, but many are just not interested in dealing with them. I'm hoping they keep them as pets and give all 4000 or so names. Just for giggles, check out NGC population reports on the MS70 dragons and then check out how many Apmex has in stock, it's quite funny....
Damn there's 1200 NGC MS70 dragons... and most of them (> 1100) are Early Releases. Assuming similar amounts at PCGS that's a sizable amount.
Yup, it's ridiculous. Take a look at how many apmex has of them...good times. Warning: not related to lunars, but the release of the ASE 25th anniversary set and sending in unopend boxes got you first strike designation and about 70% of what was sent in got MS70 grading. Now I have to ask, what kind of premium is a MS70 when 70% of the graded coins are graded as MS70 or perfect? Besides set building, which I understand, why on earth would you buy a graded set of them? You have a 7 in 10 chance that according to NGC and PCGS yours are perfect without sending them in...so why bother...
Story goes January but who knows what new 'issues' they will be facing - i.e another production line down or something like that
To be fair, they make a lot of numi stuff for themselves and also contract work for others. I'm amazed at the amount of different products they offer. The US mint pounds out 40 million Eagles, the ATB pucks, commems etc, but I'd guess it's about 1/10th of the offering Perth has considering all the contract stuff they do. That stated, the reason I'm curious is the above mentioned dealers dropped the price considerably on the 5 and 10oz, but the 1/2oz stayed the same, and only 1 dealer has them. That might be the big piece to the puzzle, just wondering if anybody knows if they'll put the 1/2 oz silver dragon back in production.
10 oz Tiger.. ive seen people unsuccesfully listing them at $500... with spot where it is $400 if you lucky and you find someone that likes the S2 Lunar Tiger Deisgn. I think the Perth Mint could easily reproduce older stuff if they got demand from an OS entity. Case in Point deadly creatures.. Red Back Spider.. ultra popular gem of modern day PM numismatics... Nek Minit... they start making a different version of the product to russians ... in this case the design had subtle variations but i really believe Perth mint choose profits over keeping there base business happy so pay premiums on UNLIMITED Perth Mint Bullion at your own risk as keeping to the word is not something Perth Mint does well. I could easily see the PM crank out the 10oz Tiger mould to bust out some more if they can establish definite demand for them. They might have trouble getting around some of there own previous statements but PR is just Spin and i think the term UNLIMITED with the precendent they set re-minting the year of the mouse would be enough to scare me off forking out hefty amounts for the non 1oz issue. 1for1 1for1
Wait ... What? You are mixing 2 very different things here. 1. The Perth Mint reminted 1oz Mice BECAUSE IT COULD. It never reached 300,000 mintage limit for 1oz Mouse as per the lunar bullion program. It is allowed to mint up to max of 300,000 1oz AT ANY TIME UNTIL 2019. The same goes for 1kg, except no mintage limit ... They can mint as many as they like up until 2019. 2. 1/2 oz, 2 oz, 5 oz, 10 oz and 1/2 kg mintings are stopped AT THE END OF THE MINT YEAR when they start to mint the next coin. Usually September. What I have writte above is LEGISLATED. You can't just go minting more legal tender whenever you feel like it. Quite basic, really. Please explain to those playing at home, how the Perth Mint will mint additional 10oz Tigers, when they can just as easily mint more 1kg coins?
Yeah there is no way they can mint more of the 10 oz tigers , they minted more of the mouse because they had not reached the 300,000 limit like rbaggio said for that matter they could make more 1/2 and 2 oz mouse they could not get away with that . Why would they anyway they dont make any more money on the bullion coins whether it is a 2012 koala or a 1/2 oz mouse. What they do make money on I beleive is all the colored proof garbage (ok some of it is cool) at 350% over spot , which I personally think is part of why I have been waiting on dragon bullion orders since september!! yet they have released all kinds of junk and they cant keep up with the bullion???
