Websites for nutjobs

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by mmm....shiney!, Feb 8, 2020.

  1. ParanoidAndroid

    ParanoidAndroid Well-Known Member

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    For consideration.

    If some members of the public were to read the forums on this website they may easily put SS in the same category as websites for nut jobs...
     
  2. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    The truth is verifiably objective. Otherwise it wouldn't be called the truth eg crimes are immoral, as is racism, bigotry, the sun rises in the east etc. Our morality and scientifically based reason codifies what we choose to value. Fortunately for humanity morality and science are also an evolutionary concept. Religion aint. :p

    We either uphold the sanctity of private property or we don't. If we do then we uphold liberty, if we don't then we don't uphold liberty. Private property rights (which includes both our bodies and our possessions) trump all other rights. They are the paramount rights (aka negative rights) because they are not conferred, they exist, or they should exist by the very nature that we are human.

    Because we voluntarily choose to engage with organisations such as Facebook or Twitter, whereas we don't have a choice with governments. Hence why anarcho-capitalists argue that the monopoly State is immoral.
     
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  3. Jason1

    Jason1 Active Member

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    the OP left out Silverstackers.com to that list lol
     
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  4. milled

    milled Active Member

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    I don't see it that way. Observation is fallible and prone to bias.

    Questioning the "truth" is the heart of modern scientific philosophy and has been since the Renaissance.

    If the truth were self-evident and true to all people, why do lies exist? The topic of "the truth" has engaged philosophers since antiquity across cultures, eg characterised in the Indian parable of the blind men and the elephant.

    Crimes are not necessarily immoral. Crime is defined in law and as Bastiat (libertarian) said, the law is nothing more than legislated force. Also, what may be morally true for one person is not for another. One man's bread etc. To some people, 18C is moral. It is however, state determined censure of speech. Would this matter if it is was derived in universal "truth". Maybe it would not matter, but a few UQ students were prosecuted for what could hardly be considered immoral or even unlawful speech. The Gillard government almost got through legislation that would have made offending feelings a crime.

    It could be argued that stripping away the state from church in government has changed little other than the main actors. Organised secular zealotry has the same form as religious piety.

    You mention bigotry, which is interesting. This literally means intolerance. I wonder how you might consider that in terms of the premise of this thread :p

    What a lot of people call truth is little more than a set of beliefs which are used as a scaffold to problem-solving. But they are beliefs nonetheless, often untested critically. It's how things are. You can only know so much so this is why I think much of objective truth is unknowable. We only learned to write 5000 years ago.
     
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  5. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    People tell lies because they’re fallible. It’s human nature. It doesn’t refute the existence of truth.

    If we deny the existence of objective truths then we succumb to the subjective interpretation of morality ie the rule of law, and the manner in which we interact with others becomes circumscribed. This can lead to systems of social organisation where individual’s lives and experiences can be sacrificed for others. We could even justify into existence abominations such as child brides and slavery.

    The middle-ages is a good example of how society would be structured under a system that upholds the subjective nature of truth.

    And bigotry is irrational intolerance, therefore it’s unable to be justified. The same goes for intolerances that are religious based such as someone who hates gays like Israel Folau.
     
  6. milled

    milled Active Member

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    "If we deny the existence of objective truths then we succumb to the subjective interpretation of morality ie the rule of law, and the manner in which we interact with others becomes circumscribed. This can lead to systems of social organisation where individual’s lives and experiences can be sacrificed for others. We could even justify into existence abominations such as child brides and slavery."

    Agree with that. But Islam is the truth for a huge number of people in the world. And in some countries, woe betide anyone who disagrees.

    Speaking of bigotry, to my reading it connotes fastidious adherence and brooks no quarter with anyone who begs differently. I think the issue is that bigotry is unreasonable, taken to mean it is heavyhanded, rather than nonsensical (ie irrational).

    That is, the reasoning behind it can be understood by an observer, it is just that the extent of it is overkill. So, it might be clear as day why someone intolerantly acts in a bloodyminded manner, but they aren't being irrational, just over the top.

    I would think shutting down nutjob websites is objectively intolerant, but makes perfect sense to me although could be viewed as unreasonable (in the sense of taking things too far)

    It is to me a modern political contrivance to stigmatise and pathologise the word. A great example was George Brandis saying "People have the right to be bigots". He was howled down in a torrent of bigotry!
     
  7. milled

    milled Active Member

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    People also tell fibs due to motivation to do so. When looking at the often spectacular success of the lie in the history of the world, it's no shock that everyone does it at sometime and is essential to political success.

    Once upon a time I haunted the hotcopper forums. People tell enormous whoppers there regularly and dissenters are routinely smeared as "downrampers" with sinister motivation, as if the idiots mindlessly shilling equities are somehow saints. In that worldview - the moral thing to do is promotion of a stock for the greater good when the truth of the matter is it is everyone in it for themselves.

    It comes as no surprise when as a consequence, it turns into a giant delusional greedy circle jerk right before the moment when everyone loses their dough. It all comes down to fallibility as you say. Truth outs the lie.

    The problem there is that the fools push hard for censure on dissent, because the truth hurts, but in so doing create a rod for their own back.

    It would be better to allow dissension some breathing space, because sometimes it proves to be the nucleus of future truth. ZH has had plenty of examples of this, even though obviously a site that thrives on doom.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
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  8. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Okay, put it this way. If someone was invited into your home are you saying that you should forgo your right to determine what is acceptable behaviour in the name of allowing dissension? Of course not. It’s the same on a private forum.
     
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  9. pmbug

    pmbug Active Member

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    In reference to the OP...

    ZH is a platform that publishes original content alongside content from folks who pay for a channel. The quality of stuff posted there varies. I personally find that ZH does publish interesting facts on occasion, even if it is embedded in a lot of TEOTWAWKI type hyperbole.

    I don't read InfoWars at all, so no opinion on their content.

    Brietbart is a propaganda outlet. If your political viewpoints align with theirs, you likely think it's great. If not, not.

    Bottom line, the internet is a jungle and I favor the free exchange of ideas. The owner of this (and any) forum obviously has the right and responsibility to manage the community as s/he sees fit, but it's not an easy job. Finding the right balance between free expression and censorship depends a lot on the community itself (ie. the degree to which they tolerate censorship or free expression is a reflection of the body).
     
  10. tas stacker

    tas stacker Active Member

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    Well I know one of thouse websites comes under sleazeball politics and is probably run buy a troll farm
     
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  11. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    when the Wuhan infections number were low, people accuse the gov of hiding info
    when suddenly the number increased substantially with new confirmation, people are not happy for that large number
    they all have forgotten the most important thing, the people infected, so that they could be treated and recover from it
    weird world of nutjobs
     
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  12. 66rounds

    66rounds Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Same with shutting down the cities "omg look at their reaction must be huge"
    If they did nothing "omg CCP are trying to kill their people and the world"
     
  13. precious roar

    precious roar Active Member

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    Rightly so
     
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  14. Court Jester

    Court Jester Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  15. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    in three months the coronavirus crisis will be OVER. That’s only an analysis. “much of the hysteria is just CIA propaganda.”
     
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  16. 66rounds

    66rounds Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Perhaps but don't rule out a secondary or tertiary outbreak in Singapore or Indonesia
     
  17. minimilled

    minimilled Member

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    If it is CIA propaganda, why did Russia ban all Chinese?
     
  18. Gonzo

    Gonzo Active Member

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    Dammit I just read this whole thread hoping for some recommendations of websites where I could glean an alternative view of the truth rather than reading the utter garbage posted by the fake mainstream news outlets which, at best, is dumbing us down and, at worst, is a propaganda machine like no other deliberately misinforming us. And yes, I believe it's the latter. I'll leave this with a quote from Thomas Jefferson:

    "Nothing can now be believed which is seen in a newspaper. Truth itself becomes suspicious by being put into that polluted vehicle. The real extent of this state of misinformation is known only to those who are in situations to confront facts within their knowledge with the lies of the day. I really look with commiseration over the great body of my fellow citizens, who, reading newspapers, live and die in the belief that they have known something of what has been passing in the world." (Letter to John Norvell, June 14, 1807)

    Jefferson also said: "I will add, that the man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them; inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors."

    So for those interested in some websites which normally add some better value to my day... I will add TruePundit and GatewayPundit as well as listening to Greg Hunter from USA Watchdog.
     
  19. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    For those right-wing nutters amongst us whose bias often clouds their judgment (as well as a lack of brain cells), and who are quick to deride factcheck.org because it posts the truth about Trump's lies and his penchant for twisting the truth - well here's an article standing up for the Orange Buffoon.

    https://www.factcheck.org/2020/02/trump-has-condemned-white-supremacists/
     
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  20. Oddjob

    Oddjob Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Next thing you know, someone will want to list Bix Weir's "Road to Roota" website on the "bad list". :eek:
     

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