Sad sad story of poor kids versus the rich in NYC.

Discussion in 'Markets & Economies' started by TheEnd, Dec 13, 2013.

  1. SilverSaviour

    SilverSaviour New Member

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    Why is the gap between rich and poor a problem anyway ?
    I would love to hear an answer to that question that is even the least bit convincing
     
  2. trew

    trew Active Member Silver Stacker

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    This thread reminds me of a movie I saw once.... had a guy called Scrooge in it....
     
  3. SilverSaviour

    SilverSaviour New Member

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    Why do you feel that way Trew ?
    What is your view?
     
  4. AngloSaxon

    AngloSaxon Active Member

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    For someone to amass great wealth, they don't do it all on their own. They will have invested some amount, that went to pay the people that work for them and all the services, products etc used by the business to generate that wealth. To make back that amount they invested requires everyone around them making money. If someone generates wealth, a lot more people are taken along for that ride and they directly benefit.

    A planet doesn't need to reinvest its' mass every time it grows, it has gravity on its' side. Crony capitalism has the gravity of government to flow money towards the crony companies reliant upon the force of the state to generate tax from the genuinely productive around them. That's not analogous to free markets/capitalism at all.
     
  5. Trichter

    Trichter Member

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    I hope you are being facetious.
     
  6. AngloSaxon

    AngloSaxon Active Member

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    Just watched the video. The graph at the start I noticed something immediately. The terms of nasty evil conservative Rudy Guiliani saw the rate of people using shelters stable and at times decreasing. When he left office in 2002 and kind caring progressive loves-everyone Michael Bloomberg took over, the rates of homeless shot up.

    And the video even criticises kind caring progressive Bloomberg for being a part of the problem. Bloomberg is an advocate of massive government, constant government intervention into the private lives of individuals, and his spending and policies in New York reflect that.

    New York may be where Wall Street is and is seen as a centre of capitalism, but this video shows that the people struggling in NY are NOT victims of capitalism, they are victims of the socialist policies of the local and State government.
     
  7. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    No. It was a straightforward question w.r.t. people demonising capitalism as opposed to any wealth transfer (aka theft) created by the crony capitalism that AngloSaxon mentioned.
     
  8. Newtosilver

    Newtosilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Ummm because you have children starving (poor) and people with billion of dollars who spend $20,000.00 on a handbag (rich). So therefore the gap is not a good thing?

    Maybe I am missing something?
     
  9. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Yes, you are missing something very fundamental. Recognising my added caveat about crony capitalism, how did the rich person acquire their wealth? (Using general concepts obviously, not specifics.)
     
  10. Tacrezod

    Tacrezod Member

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    For the sake of this particular debate, children don't count. Children are reliant on their parents to provide for them. Maybe the question should be;

    "Why is the gap between [a] rich [adult] and [a] poor [adult] a problem anyway?"
     
  11. worldbubble

    worldbubble Active Member

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    respected guys ... giving jobs to people ...
    why robber then?
    [​IMG]
     
  12. Newtosilver

    Newtosilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    How ID the rich person acquire there wealth? Depends on who the rich person or company is Walmart? Pablo Escobar? Thaksin Shinawatra?

    Walmart screws there suppliers, does not pay enough for it's employees to live on so the govt needs to provide food stamps to them, Pablo Escobar was a drug Barron and Thaksin Shinawatra made billions screwing over the country of Thailand. Obviously not the only ways to make money. So three possible answers, using the system to their advantage, drug crime and corruption :)

    Does not really matter, the question was "why is the gap between rich and poor a problem anyway?"

    My answer was because you have children (the poor) starving and the rich buying $20,000.00 handbags. Seems pretty reasonable answer to me.
     
  13. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  14. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    As I said in my original post, you cannot say anything useful about the distribution of wealth until you can answer where the wealth comes from (and not using your stupidly simplistic description of Walmart).

    Edit: Maybe start with THIS and THIS article about Walmart and think about it more before jumping to the standard propaganda.
     
  15. Newtosilver

    Newtosilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Obviously I would not understand :)

    Saw in the link how Walmart needs to be praised....... Seriously??

    As I said before I think you are big on theory, practically not so much.
     
  16. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    You "saw" the link(s), but you clearly did not read it/them. To debate a point the other party actually needs to read the other person's position.

    C'mon. How is wealth created and how can one amass wealth without using fraud, force or theft against others? Surely it is useful for you to learn about this very basic concept before you try to debate economics?

    And as I said before, I gave you extremely practical advice. Please tell me what was wrong with my practical advice and I'll try to tell it to you better.
     
  17. AngloSaxon

    AngloSaxon Active Member

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    Theres a lot of standard propaganda on Walmart. When I was at uni the standard propaganda was just about Nike. Clearly the hate has moved on from one company and their suppliers to the whole retail industry.
     
  18. Newtosilver

    Newtosilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Why don't you tell me, you are the expert :) with your practical advice, no offence but I do not think it is useful and personally I would stay way from it. No need to tell it to me better :) I have done very well for myself on my own.
     
  19. SilverSaviour

    SilverSaviour New Member

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    As far as the west is concerned... The poor have never been better off in the history of human kind.
    The poor today have much better living standards than the upper classes a couple of hundred years ago.

    So is it the gap between rich and poor the problem, or the absolute quality of life of the poor we really should be worried about ?
     
  20. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Seriously dude?! What kind of comment is that? What advice are you trying to stay away from? Undertaking useful work for a living? If you are simply a thief or a parasite then why do you even pretend to care about other people?
     

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