I think i still stand by my original statement. However, to be clear, I am not referring to numismatics, though a lot of those are highballed as well
OK so I post some stacker bars for sale - check my prices based on what previous sales have gone for here (those that still remain unedited and online of course) to make sure I'm on par with them, check Goldstackers to make sure that I am cheaper, and still get offers of 90% of spot. The reality seems to be even if a seller tries to be reasonable, you will still get silly offers. And no, I didn't specify that offers had to be at spot +x% or above, since it never occurred to me that I'd ever receive offers at spot, let alone at 10% under spot. But I know now.
To what end fishball - it will still occur. If I name them what will it achieve, not much - I just want to sell my bars, it won't be to those who offer less than I think they are worth, and they are obviously not going to pay more so it achieves nothing to name them. And since I didn't specify a floor price, just "decent offers", they could argue they were justified in offering what they did since what they offered was, in their view, a decent price. I did get a few "ah well had to try" type comments when I politely thanked them for their offer and declined it. Point I was trying to make was more in relation to the suggestions earlier that part of the fault lies with sellers having unreasonable price expectations ie it's not all one-sided. And maybe for some products or sellers that's true. I was however giving an example that even when the seller does do their due diligence, lowball offers will still come.
Because their lowballers, its quite obvious. Im not denying that they exist, but once there is a culture of trading in this manner, its hard to stamp it out. This goes for all areas of life, not just bullion. I get it every day at work with people asking for more for their gold, especially from asian people. Not because they think they should get more, but just cause they think they will try, or because its cultural, and deals need to be bargained. Ive had people bargain for half an hour, sharp and unyielding, then when they finished, its like they are a different person, all smiles and suddenly friendly. Sometimes go off and buy me a coffee. Its just business. I also do it myself, market city in sydney or QVB in melbourne,(especially on a sunday when everything is already discounted). As I said if there is a culture of this, people will do it, you wouldn't see me trying this on at coles. Having said that, I play the game as well, if I have to. Whenever I list anything for buy it now on ebay, I always list at double what I want. In come the offers, I reply politely with a counteroffer, and so on, until we agree with a price. If there is a culture of lowballers, I personally blame the highballers for starting it, but I would never delude myself about it. Its just a game, and just business, and you cant blame anyone for trying it on if its being played both ways.
I buy at spot, below spot and above spot. What I sell for generally depends on my purchase price plus how fast I want a sale. I won't sell an item for less than I paid unless I can sell another item at the same time for more than I paid to cover the shortfall and balance my profit expectations. Currently I am finding better buying from dealers and eBay whereas 9-12 months ago, I would get better buys on the forum. As long as I am happy with a deal, that's all that counts for me.
This however is the operative part - if it's a fair sale price being sought by the seller, then either buzz or negotiate from a fair position, dont start in at 90% of spot and expect me to deal with you. If as you say some sellers are highballing, that's their problem - it does not justify lowballing fair sale prices.
more to the point, why no one ask for a name and shame on highball prices. I respect we cant trash a sales thread, so most try to keep their mouth shut. However some of these asking prices are unbelievable, and when you consider that the general person has no idea of prices (proof of this, look at ebay) you could consider it on a par with what merchants such as goldbuyers are doing. Just the opposite extreme. Just the other day, I had a customer convinced a 1kg kook was worth $2500, because thats what she paid for it. Apparently I was ripping her off because i was offering her less than half of that.
yes, I also am getting spot on ebay at moment, just have to look at right places though. as soon as another rush on the silver we will lose that.
Maybe name & shame isn't the way to go but a simple message saying "mate that's below spot; nobody sells at that price" might help him/her along. I haven't actually ever received an offer of spot let alone below spot, I must be really lucky.
Deal or no deal. Please yourself, nobody's twisting your arm to buy /sell at any price. Lowballers exist?...golly! Hold the front page! Same for price gougers. They exist in all aspects of buying and selling whatever the product. "Open to offers" means you can get any number thrown at you. Be more specific about your buy/sell price if you want fewer tyre kickers. No need to name and shame members. If they arent acting "ethically" on buying or selling their reputation will suffer accordingly and probably limit their trading partnerships in the future. This will take care of itself naturally. If people on here are uninformed about values of things then they cant blame SS for the lack of info available. If in doubt ask somebody.
If you wanted to pay me spot + 3%, an opening offer of 90% wouldn't get a reply, and on principle neither would a subsequent higher offer. This forum wasn't set up to prey on people who stack metal and find themselves in a jam needing to sell. If someone needs to sell bad enough that they will accept a low price because they need a fast sale, they should price accordingly - but an opening bid 13% under your target price on goods where markups of only 2-5% are common is a joke. We're talking gold and silver, not a second hand car in the Trading Post. Given there are dealers in most cities who will pay spot on demand for bullion - when you suggest spot + 3% we're talking bullion, not junk - offers below spot for a privately offered item shouldn't get the time of day. You've commented a few times that people shouldn't expect more than spot for their metal when selling on here - and it's rubbish. This forum isn't the local Westfields or Centro where hard up uneducated mums sell their old gold jewellery to raise money for groceries. In a private peer to peer trade with items on offer of resaleable quality, there's no decent reason that a normally motivated seller should need to accept an offer that's less than a dealer's wholesale cost to buy the equivalent item. It's a free market and there's always going to be price discovery, but in this current market, anything less is predatory IMO.
With all due respect to the comments here I wish to state my view. When you try to sell stuff with op's comments such as (or similar to): "Had enough of the bullshit that goes on in here so I'm dumping everything....." Wtf do you expect? You set the tone for all that follows! Like for like!
Aah so this refers to me - mea culpa! That post went on to say give me a decent offer. I can see how that could be confusing for a potential buyer - fair nuff - it was poorly phrased but was in response to earlier lowball offers. Curiously it elicited 2 types of response - even more lowballs as you suggested it would and a couple of very fair ones. But I take your point that for that particular post it could have given a certain impression to a buyer. I guess it comes down to what people consider "decent" lol. Doesn't change the earlier lowballs at/below spot though, nor why anyone would think offers below spot would be accepted even if it were a fire sale when everyone knows they can get spot or just over from most of the forum sponsors in here, or their local dealer.
No lowballers, and no actual buyers either... Its bizarre, 2 months ago it would've flew out. Definitely something strange going on in the market. Its a damn shame Ainslie dont buy scrap, I was in there yesterday getting VERY good rates on 50c coins... Tragic really, as I didnt bother listing them here as I knew I would get MORE at Ainslie. As I said, something odd going on in trading culture at the moment...
