"The best thing you can say about libertarians is that because their views derive from abstract theory, they tend to be highly principled and rigorous in their logic." "The worst thing you can say about libertarians is that they are intellectually immature, frozen in the worldview many of them absorbed from reading Ayn Rand novels in high school."
"Let failed banks fail" is the purist line. This approach would deliver a wonderful lesson in personal responsibility, creating thousands of new jobs in the soup-kitchen and food-pantry industries. Earlier it said that libertarians say previous bailouts set a precedent for banks to do riskier gambling. Then it ends by saying that we can never let people have to take personal responsibility because we might invest poorly. Letting banks know they can't lose definitely won't affect their risk taking :lol: #stupidstatistlogic
"Such regulations [banking regulations] may, no doubt, be considered as in some respect a violation of natural liberty. But those exertions of the natural liberty of a few individuals, which might endanger the security of the whole society, are, and ought to be, restrained by the laws of all governments; of the most free, as well as of the most despotical. The obligation of building party walls, in order to prevent the communcation of fire, is a violation of natural liberty, exactly of the same kind with the regulations of the banking trade which are here proposed." Adam Smith, "The Wealth Of Nations", pg. 263
Of course, the author neglects to mention (or probably consider) that the heart of the financial system is non-market created fiat money distributed via Government created fractional reserve banks supported by Government created central banks with a group of people who sit around deciding what the price and quantity of base money for the entire currency should be this month. Nor do they mention that Warren Buffet was willing to step in and buy Long Term Capital thereby preventing the worst fears coming true (but instead the central bank engineered a bail out). Irrespective, the whole thing is a straw man. Laissez-faire economics never says that misallocation of resources, recessions, depressions, financial fraud or simple stupidity will not happen in a free market. It says that the uninterfered, natural market processes are far more likely to correct misallocation of resources compared to non-market methods and is far more likely to direct resources into the hands of the entrepreneurs and innovators with the consequent effect of building far greater levels of productive capital stock geared toward serving the interests and welfare of the masses. Consequently, recessions will be shorter (albeit potentially deeper but with a stronger rebound) and growth over time will be greater thereby lifting the prosperity of all connected with the market. PS And I still haven't read any of Ayn Rand's books and BTW Ayn Rand was an Objectivist rather than a Libertarian (and indeed, in her typical strong-willed manner, was a fierce critic at times despite the very large similarities between the two).
Let's face it, Libertarias tell us how great it is as a theory, there are some catchy jingles, if you oppose Libertarianism you oppose freedom and therefore you are a bad person. Tax is theft, meat is murder (oh wait that is a catchy phrase that PETA use) Libertarians are VERY WELL FUNDED in the US, some very rich people in the US support it. The question is why is there not one country in the world that has adopted it? It is a fringe dwellers idea, very few people actually support it if only they could see how well it would work in practice not just as a theory. I have always asked why don't Libertarians actually put it into practice even on a small scale? You don't need all this regulation imposed on people.... People just need to embrace Libertarianism and do it and all the doubters will see how amazing it is and the idea wil grow and before you know it people will embrace their new found freedom. There is that idea of building a society in international waters on a floating platforms free from govt oppression. Well you can not imagine how pleased I was to find out some Libertarians with strong financial backing decided to show the world how Libertarianism works in practice. They found a valley where they could put there principles into practice and live a life in paradise without govt oppression all based on Libertarian ideals. There were even discounts for payments in gold and Bitcoin so the evil govt or no one else could track you and impose upon your freedom. http://panampost.com/adriana-peralt...-chile-libertarian-paradise-turned-nightmare/ You can not imagine how much I laughed when I found this lol. Google it and you can read about the hype and how amazing this place was going to be. Of course it did notf fail because of Libertarian principles....... Communism did not fail because of Communist Principles either.......
I put my voluntarist beliefs into practice every single day. I don't initiate fraud, force or violence against another person or their property and don't advocate others to do so on my behalf. All of my interactions with my friends, family, colleagues and strangers are conducted on a mutually agreeable and voluntary basis. If I did violate these principles accidentally or deliberately I would expect people to feel aggrieved by my actions and seek to obtain redress from me in one way or another. Although I would expect and hope that others acted in the same way I am not naive enough to assume that they will. Consequently I use cost effective methods to reduce the likelihood my person or property will be aggressed against by others. What do you do?
I don't do what well resourced, supposedly intelligent, successful libertarians did in Chile lol. If they are the smart Libertarians and the people who drive the Libertarian movement, the movers and shakers I would hate to see how it turns out for the average person lol. Oh, oh, oh one that really made me laugh when you read up on how it went to poo in Chile and all the Libertarians got burnt there was some idiot who said "take them to court and have the court sort it out, that is what Libertarians do" sounds like a good idea until you put it in practice. Judge : so how was payment made? Libertarian : I paid $500,000.00 in gold and Bitcoin judge. Judge to Defendant : where is the money? Defendant : I lost my phone your honour and the Bitcoin were on it, I don't know how Bitcoin works really and I think I lost it......... Judge to Libertarian : how much is your legal bill so far? Libertarian : $200,000.00 your honour, I really need to get that $500,000.00 back. Defendant : your honour I have $7.37 in my bank account and I am defending myself since I do not have a lawyer as I can not afford one. Judge : where is the gold you were payed with? Defendant : I burned it when I was drunk, I actually buried about 8 million in gold from other people as well who invested in the project your honour but I can not remember where I buried it. Also had about 4 million in Bitcoin but as I said I lost my phone, I may have accidently buried it with the gold. Your honour to be honest it has been a rough ride and I can not honestly remember where it went. I could pay it back at approx $12 a week based on my current income. Judge : are you people stupid? Libertarian : no your honour we are not stupid we are Libertarians. Judge orders defendant to pay the money back at $15 a fortnight and for the defendant to try and find his phone lol. I hear there are some cheap blocks of land being sold in Chile, great climate, bugger all regulation and no govt interference
Okay. So that's one thing that you don't do and luckily enough I didn't do it either so we're even. What about what you actually do day to day?
He won't have an honest discussion with you. Watch him deflect and go on to give you nothing of any real substance.
What do I do day to day? Much the same as 99% of other Australians... Live in the real world not a world of theory.
Oh if you want more detail, I put my voluntarist beliefs into practice every single day. I don't initiate fraud, force or violence against another person or their property and don't advocate others to do so on my behalf. All of my interactions with my friends, family, colleagues and strangers are conducted on a mutually agreeable and voluntary basis. If I did violate these principles accidentally or deliberately I would expect people to feel aggrieved by my actions and seek to obtain redress from me in one way or another. Although I would expect and hope that others acted in the same way I am not naive enough to assume that they will. Consequently I use cost effective methods to reduce the likelihood my person or property will be aggressed against by others. I would believe in mateship and everyone gets a fair go, people who need a hand get help, I believe in a strong sense of community and the ideals of democracy - everyone gets a say if they have money or not. I also believe just because people have money they do not get special treatment. I als believe a person's value is not base on their job or if they can afford a good lawyer. I am also very big on the common good as a society not just selfish individuals who have a sense of entitlement. No one gets left behind.
In terms of otherwise intelligent, switched on people being taken for a ride by sophisticated fraudsters, I have two words: Bernie Madoff.
That sounds pretty much exactly in tune with myself. Correct me if I am wrong then, but the difference it would seem is that you are willing to accept that certain individuals have authority and privileges which means that they are allowed to initiate fraud, force or violence against other people or their property and that you actively advocate and support them in doing so to obtain certain outcomes that you deem desirable.
So why does'nt Libertarianism work in the real world and only in theory? Also why does no one want Libertarianism? In theUS it gets less than 1.5% of the vote and that is described as the most successful result they have ever had by a long shot. It is very well funded and has some very rich and successful people pushing it. The community in Chile is very small scale, has very smart people who had heaps of cash and they are experts in Libertarianism. Hippies start communities and they seem to run really well. Seems to be a lot of noise and hot air by a minority group pushing an agenda that not only no-one wants but it does not even work on a very small scale. It seems it has come to light that people are unsure even owns the land the community is based on. People have handed over millions and they are trying to actually establish who owns the whole thing lol. Seriously? What a joke.
I knew this is where you were going to go with this lol. I am happy to live in a functioning society, a democracy like Australia, to have that functioning society I am willing to pay tax, obey laws that are for the benefit of society. I am happy to have gun laws, speed limits, drink driving laws, building regulations etc. there is no fraud, violance against others or theft that is used. That is rehtoric that sounds good but fails under examination, the old tax is theft... Bullshit you pay taxes, you get roads, footpaths, public schools and hospitals as well as programs for the sustainment of a functioning society. You are being forced to obey speed limits that the govt imposes, you are being stopped from doing urinating wherever you want in public places. That is the govt limiting your freedom? The fact is theft is what 95% of Australians want. Could the system be better? Hell yes but guess what.... Democracy works. Libertarianism? Well refer to the link in the other post for the most successful, largest scale Libertarian attempt at a community - it was and is a shitfight. I am all ears for a system that is a better alternative to democracy, Libertarianism is not it though.
If that is indeed fact, could u please kindly direct me to where I can read about this study? Thanks.
