How high do you go for fractional?

Discussion in 'Silver' started by Cind3r, Jul 29, 2019.

  1. Cind3r

    Cind3r Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Top of the mornin to ya Stackers

    I am totally hooked on fractional anything.....Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Butter.... you name it I'm loving it.
    I have this inner desire to have a massive pile of smalls for the SHTF trade situation (including food but don't get me started or i wont shut up).

    I want to know your opinion on how much your willing to pay for fractional silver over spot for use in the event of a collapse?

    I believe silver will be the common currency (besides food/survival stuff) in said event and think 5g - 10g items will be very useful. I have been looking at 5g bars for about $8.5 each ($52.88/oz in 10 packs) and 10g bars for $15 each ($46.66/oz in 10 packs) and just don't know how i feel about the price. The 92.5% Threepence @0.0419oz/coin pure are also an option but i do prefer the 999 stuff.

    Let me know what you would do for fractional :)
     
  2. stackmans

    stackmans Member

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    I wont pay much premium over silver and usually don't buy fractional silver at all due to the crazy premiums. I own some fractional gold and I've been known to accidentally pay too much for round 50s on ebay but its purely for investment/ownership purposes.

    I believe even in a SHTF situation that not enough of the great unwashed own silver for it to become a universal currency and when you cant even afford food, silver will be even less desirable (you cant eat it). If I was seriously going to prep for a end of all civilisation scenario I'd be investing in some rural land in the middle of nowhere with a dedicated water source. Then start stockpiling diesel and ammunition!
     
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  3. Ian Gillman

    Ian Gillman Member

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    I try to aim for 25% or less.
     
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  4. systematic

    systematic Well-Known Member

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    The last GFC was a demonstration of the resilience of the status quo .... it is unlikely there will be a SHTF scenario in Oz ...
     
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  5. Cind3r

    Cind3r Active Member Silver Stacker

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    I totally agree, so then if you were just stacking fractional for fun whats the premium you would accept? 25% or less like Ian?
     
  6. sammysilver

    sammysilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Fractionals aint fractionals!!!!

    If you're thinking of a SHTF scenario, think of the people that you are dealing with. The hoi polloi.

    If you are bartering, they will have no idea of the value of silver! 50% post '45, 92.5% pre '46, 80% round 50's, plus the fractional 999's.

    At best they may have picked up in the paper that a round fifty is worth $8 and an old florin is worth $4. Don't spend an hour arguing that a pre florin is worth twice as much as a post florin.

    If you want to stack fractionals, don't go beyond post florins and shillings!!!

    These you should get at spot or 1% or 2% above.
     
  7. GoldenEye

    GoldenEye Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    I agree with Sammysilver. If you want fractional silver you can't go past the Australian predecimal coins. Most people still recognise them as our old silver money, you've got very few fakes, and you can still find it at close to spot price. You can also add the old silver 1966 round 50s as well, but at nearly $10 each you'll also need some small change like a threepence.
     
  8. Jislizard

    Jislizard Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    I collect Junk Silver, I tend to get it from private dealers and if you aren't looking for anything more exciting than 50% Australian Pre Decimal, and you are happy to buy in bulk, then spot is achievable, sometimes less. Most dealers build up an accumulation of undesirable coins and are happy to get close to spot for it just to get it out of the shop, it takes up valuable space.

    For anything a bit more exotic, USA 90%, UK Pre dec etc. you can spend a bit more if you are interested in a bit of variety in your stack, but if you are only interested in having a nice stash for the end of the world as we know it, then I would get the cheapest pre dec you can lay you hands on.

    I generally buy it by the kilo.

    I have bought individual coins for higher, but for run of the mill stuff, I wouldn't bother paying more than 10% unless postage was included or there were some interesting coins in the lot.
     
  9. Ag bullet

    Ag bullet Well-Known Member

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    Thousandths of a ton.
     
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  10. swoydaz

    swoydaz Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Post 1946 Australian shillings and florins.
    1966 Australian 50 cent coins.
    Low forgery rate I would say.
    Easy to identify.
    Easy to determine silver content.
    Easy to determine dollar value.
     
  11. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    1 bag 0r 1000 bags
    in most SHTF cases, a bag or two is more than sufficient
     
  12. openeyes

    openeyes Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Buying existing silver based Australian coins makes sense. People know them. Don’t pay much more than spot. They are easily tradeable before or after anything serious happening. Keep it simple.
     
  13. Ipv6Ready

    Ipv6Ready Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    If youre stacking fractional for fun, buy anything you like.

    Why does money come into play?
     
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  14. SlyGuy

    SlyGuy Active Member

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    Silver will never become currency again. Neither will gold.

    In prolonged SHTF (crazy weather, nuclear war or plague kills 99% of ppl, etc), barter system and groups of like minded folks would be what you need; sustainable water and food and bullets are >>> metals. You are talking about a doomsday and repopulate the Earth scenerio. This is real life, not a sci-fi movie. A scenerio like this is as unlikely as the day is long, and if it happened, would you even want to be alive anyways with virtually zero quality of life on a scorched Earth where everyone is running around muddy and scratching for berries or squirrels to eat?

    SHTF from social/political/financial/civil war reasons is highly unlikely to occur for any prolonged timespan in modern society. It is pretty pointless to plan on prepping for anything extending beyond a few months, and again, the plan is food and water. It is not too wise to be trying to trade metals with starving angry sleepless homeless people. It is also not too wise to fight them off with weapons... get your bag and get gone before the riots or danger reaches your location. Those who leave hurricane/war/looting etc zones early are generally the people who survive and thrive. If a society gets to the brink of turmoil in today's age with essential services breaking down, crisis, riots, etc... then a new leader (usually military - either domestic or foreign) or weakened leader (same govt prints more money) just swoops in and hoses down the rioters, re-stabilizes the currency, or creates new currency. This has happened in Greece, Turkey, Russia, Argentina, dot com, GFC, etc etc etc recently.

    ...the strength of precious metals is that they generally offset inflation and are compact stores of wealth (gold>>>silver). They allow you to not be overly leveraged in one single currency and allow you to be independent of banks. In practical terms, if Aussie civil war broke out or the AUD collapsed, you can take a bike or boat to safer places with a bag of gold on your person and have a decent amount of wealth at any other place in the world you may end up. You can do it with silver, but you're very limited in carrying capacity and stealth... even more limited with fractional. Metals preserve some wealth and circumvents the pitfalls of banks and currency strength, but it does nothing for trade (besides possibly a border crossing bribe... in which case you still want small and valuable metals).

    In short, for SHTF:
    "Bug in" to ride out storm/disaster/social crisis = significant provisions (food/water/warm) ...metals just a small % of portfolio as a hedge
    and "Bug out" (flee to safety) = basic provisions backpack + compact wealth (gold)
    ...silver just has no logical role in any of it.

    The only sensible reason to buy fractional is with something very valuable (eg, gold) where you may not have many buyers for large bars or even full sized coins. If you believe silver will become that highly valuable someday, then pay high premiums for half, quarter, etc ounce coins. Everyone stacks for different reasons, but unless you like the looks or the numi aspect, fractional silver as logically useful in any scenerio is nonsense imo. I don't own any fractional aside from a few thow-in coins I got at spot price when buying mixed lots. But my opinion doesn't matter. It's about what you like and how you envision it working out. I would be interested in a plausible scenerio where silver is traded. Don't you think that if Australian govt fractured, the military would just take it over and make their own currency... or China would? GL
    Yep^^^
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2019
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  15. systematic

    systematic Well-Known Member

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    Spot ... for fun ...
     
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  16. JohnnyBravo300

    JohnnyBravo300 Well-Known Member

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    Most people wouldnt understand the value of bartering with silver and most people wouldnt have preps either. The stackers and peppers understand this stuff and youd have to deal with those types.
    If they dont know the value of metals then chances are they wouldnt have anything anyway and theres no reason to teach them. For the average person eating their pets and digging through dumpsters, youd be better to move on. Theyd have nothing.
     
  17. Gullintanni

    Gullintanni Well-Known Member

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    I would agree with sammy on this as well.
    If you honestly believe that SHTF is coming or even any real downturn that will not quite be SHTF then you should be looking at tobacco and possibly even commonly available codeine/mix tablets.

    Most people will not give a loss about silver or gold but many will seek the other two things ive mentioned.
    Dont stack for SHTF, you stack because the financial system gives these metals value.
     
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  18. Jim4silver

    Jim4silver Well-Known Member

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    If true SHTF, nobody will trade precious food and water for shiny trinkets. Unless you live next to an Amish community, most likely your neighbors have less than you do, so what will they have to trade you for your silver and gold? Guns and ammo would be worth much more than metals in a SHTF for those here in the US.

    The way that gold and silver would be a valuable "barter" tool would be not if SHTF, but if things are going OK but that cash is banned/eliminated. If they don't ban precious metals as well (or even if they do), silver and gold coins/bars would be worth much for those who wanted privacy for transactions and a long time historical well-accepted storage of value.

    That day is coming for all industrialized nations when cash is eliminated. Maybe 10 years or more, or perhaps less. By the time it happens there will be no real outcry because it will be cloaked as a way to stop tax cheats and criminals. The law abiding who are already conditioned to use a card for everything won't care. Especially if they give some free "credits" or whatever when you sign up. I'm guessing, but perhaps in the US this would happen after some bad "crash" and the dollar goes bust and gets replaced by something else.

    I don't think in the US at least they will ever confiscate/ban silver or gold (again like in 1933), at least not as long as the rest of the Constitution is in place.
     
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  19. openeyes

    openeyes Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Anyone actually been in a SHTF situation?
     
  20. JohnnyBravo300

    JohnnyBravo300 Well-Known Member

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    I was at a convenience store once and the payment system went down. It was cash or nothing and some people had to leave empty handed without their snacks and fuel. It was scary and we hugged. I almost cried a little but tried to be strong for my wife.
    Luckily we had cash so we filled our tank and left with doritos and slurpees. We were lucky to survive and I'll never forget the fear that day. The day it hit the fan for me.
     
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