Cash payments over $10,000 to be banned on July 1 2019

Discussion in 'Currencies' started by ozcopper, May 8, 2018.

  1. willrocks

    willrocks Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Perhaps groceries wasn't a good example. However in my experience the enforcers of law often abuse their powers. For example terrorism laws are used and abused all the time. What if enforcers decide groceries are actually "one supply".

    There's a lot of edge-cases including ongoing supplies such as wages, debt repayment, sub-contractors ... etc. Are they "a supply", or a "series of supplies"?

    Tax evasion is already a crime. People who are already doing something illegal aren't going to care much about breaking another cash ban law. This law isn't about catching tax evaders, it's about taking people's freedom and forcing them to use the banking cartel.
     
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  2. STC

    STC Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    If you build a $12k shed & pay $4k deposit in cash then the rest card?
     
  3. leo25

    leo25 Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    $9,999.95 :p
     
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  4. willrocks

    willrocks Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Or $9999.999999999' (in crypto) :p
     
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  5. Oddjob

    Oddjob Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Apparently, the bill has been widened and now includes bans on cash deposits and withdrawals over AUD10k too.

    Update vid today from Martin North and the CEC.



    Note: Edited due to poor spelling.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
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  6. milled

    milled Active Member

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    will try and find the proposed broader scope of the bill to banking (ie not just commercial trading) - I think that would be headline news at least in the alt media and I haven't seen it
     
  7. milled

    milled Active Member

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    so according to that - the proposal is to concentrate the power for transactions of 10k+ into the Minister's hands. That is it will be allowed by Ministerial regulation but the Minister can ban it at a moment's notice

    is this megalomania from Freydenberg?
     
  8. milled

    milled Active Member

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    a few footnotes
    Abbotts government proposed a bail in bill to banks along the lines of Cyprus which would freeze depositors holdings allowing the banks to use them in a crisis
    https://gumshoenews.com/2018/01/27/libs-labor-greens-set-bail-bank-deposits-already-done-deal/

    then

    Labor proposed a ban on $100 bills
    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016...proposes-ban-100-bill-no-cash-within-10-years

    Now with the 10k cash ban proposal, the idea that this is to raise 3billion AUD for the budget is clearly not the principal reason, for that amount is tiny compared to the overall public debt deficit and the negatives obviously outweigh any benefit
    https://treasury.gov.au/consultation/c2019-t395788

    a take on this all is that it paves the way for NIRP - quite obvious looking at the RBAs cash rate data that the direction is towards NIRP
     
  9. milled

    milled Active Member

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    So, looking at the draft legislation, you will see that any individual will be made a criminal for paying or receiving payment in excess of 10k - not just businesses, but any ENTITY (this is defined to include individuals, see below)

    Per the draft Currency (Restrictions on the Use of Cash) Bill 2019

    entity
    has the meaning given by the Income Tax Assessment Act 1997.
    Note: Subsection 960100(1) of the Income Tax Assessment Act 1997 provides that entity means any of the following:

    (a) an individual;

    (b) a body corporate;

    (c) a body politic;

    (d) a partnership;

    (e) any other unincorporated association or body of persons;

    (f) a trust;

    (g) a *superannuation fund;

    (h) an *approved deposit fund.

    Asterisked terms are further defined in the Income Tax Assessment Act 1997.



    10 Offence—Cash payments in excess of cash payment limit (strict liability)


    Single payment that exceeds cash payment limit

    (1) An entity commits an offence if:

    (a) the entity:

    (i) makes a payment to another entity; or

    (ii) accepts a payment from another entity; and

    (b) the payment is or includes an amount of cash; and

    (c) the value of the cash equals or exceeds the cash payment limit.

    Penalty: 60 penalty units.

    (2) Strict liability applies to paragraphs (1)(b) and (c).

    Note: For strict liability, see section 6.1 of the Criminal Code.

    Series of payments that exceeds cash payment limit

    (3) An entity commits an offence if:

    (a) the entity:

    (i) makes a payment to another entity; or

    (ii) accepts a payment from another entity; and

    (b) the payment is part of a series of payments that are made for a supply or as a gift; and

    (c) the payment is or includes an amount of cash; and

    (d) as a result of the payment, the total value of all amounts of cash included in the payments in the series equals or exceeds the cash payment limit.

    Penalty: 60 penalty units.

    (4) Strict liability applies to paragraphs (3)(c) and (d).

    Note: For strict liability, see section 6.1 of the Criminal Code.

    Exception—kinds of transactions to which this section does not apply

    (5) Subsections (1) and (3) do not apply to a payment that is:

    (a) of a kind specified by the Minister by legislative instrument; or

    (b) made in circumstances specified by the Minister by legislative instrument; or

    (c) accepted in circumstances specified by the Minister by legislative instrument.

    Note 1: A defendant bears an evidential burden in relation to the matters in subsection (5): see subsection 13.3(3) of the Criminal Code.

    Note 2: The Minister may specify different circumstances for paragraphs (b) and (c). For example, a circumstance might relate to the state of mind of the person who accepts the payment and be specified for paragraph (c).

    Note 3: The Minister may specify different matters for the purposes of this section and section 11.

    Jurisdiction

    (6) Section 15.2 (extended jurisdiction—category B) of the Criminal Code applies to an offence against subsection (1) or (3).

    11 Offence—Cash payments in excess of cash payment limit

    Single payment that exceeds cash payment limit

    (1) An entity commits an offence if:

    (a) the entity:

    (i) makes a payment to another entity; or

    (ii) accepts a payment from another entity; and

    (b) the payment is or includes an amount of cash; and

    (c) the value of the cash equals or exceeds the cash payment limit.

    Penalty: Imprisonment for 2 years or 120 penalty units, or both.

    Series of payments that exceeds the cash payment limit




     
  10. milled

    milled Active Member

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    note the "entity" also refers to "body politic" - meaning that a series of transactions amounting to over 10k is regarded as criminal if made in physical or digital currency to a political organisation
     
  11. milled

    milled Active Member

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    note the above clearly, a series of payments that is intended as a gift, also makes you a criminal!

    note that a single payment above 10k is an imprisonable offence.
     
  12. milled

    milled Active Member

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    no, under the new draft legislation (with Enquiry date set to 07.02.20), a series of payments totalling over that amount is treated similarly. The penalty is "60 units" (for a single payment over 10k, the penalty is 2 years in prison and/or 120 units.
     
  13. SilverDJ

    SilverDJ Well-Known Member

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    No law against selling the wheels separately for say, oh, $5k each.
     
  14. milled

    milled Active Member

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    the bid deal is that total control over transaction goes very well with "social credit scoring" - to cut a person out of transacting with others based on the whim of government. You should have seen enough of this with the stripping of payment processors from those with right of centre views online. This means that a dissenter will literally be cut out of transaction, because transaction must be conducted within the grid.

    the other obvious issue is that it means negative interest rates can be applied with gusto, for nobody can escape unless by purchasing assets that rise under NIRP in small enough denominations that they fall under the preset limit (whether it is 500, 5000, 10000) etc.

    One ounce gold logically will become unsellable FTF at some point as the price will rise and cash sale will not be legal any more

    There are already self-interested parties that want the limit dropped to 2k. If that happens, all one ounce gold in Australia becomes illegal to sell for cash.
     
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  15. Number 47

    Number 47 Well-Known Member

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    Where's the pushback from out prominent business leaders.
    (Insert the sound of crickets)

    We need a few people with balls to stand up and call it out for what it is.
    Just another new law to add more layers of financial control to everyday people, making criminals out of perfectly honest people going about their lives, minding their own buisnes.

    Bring back Kerry, blokes like him would've been made instant criminals with this law.
     
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  16. milled

    milled Active Member

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    the draft legislation states that *a series of payments* is the same as the single payment over 10k. The main difference is that 60 penalty units are applied, not 120.
     
  17. kilo

    kilo Active Member Silver Stacker

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  18. kilo

    kilo Active Member Silver Stacker

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  19. willrocks

    willrocks Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  20. JulieW

    JulieW Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    "10th smallest black economy out of 158 countries".

    Put another way, Australia is one of the top 10 tax evading countries in the world.

    :D
     

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