ATO targeting Bitcoin

Discussion in 'Digital Currencies' started by doomsday surprise, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. doomsday surprise

    doomsday surprise Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    The Australian Taxation Office is taking aim at Bitcoin users who could be attracted to the burgeoning virtual currency by the possibility of hiding transactions and dodging tax.

    Despite the ability to trade virtual currencies like Bitcoin anonymously, the ATO is confident it can track users in efforts to stop fraud.

    "Bitcoin is no more anonymous than physical cash and the ATO has experience in working with earlier forms of -anonymous electronic money systems, and with physical cash, which are relevant for responding to new and emerging -systems," ATO senior assistant -com-missioner for the cash economy Michael Hardy told The Australian -Financial Review.

    The ATO confirmed that it is monitoring the currency, along with other electronic payment systems. Last week it was revealed that the currency is facing -scrutiny from the US revenue authority.


    More here -

    http://www.afr.com/p/technology/ato_targets_bitcoin_users_oawpzLQHDz2vEUWtvYLTWI
     
  2. goanna

    goanna Member Silver Stacker

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    They can't track the cash economy but they can follow electronic funds transfers quite easily.
     
  3. renovator

    renovator Well-Known Member

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    yes they can.anyone that thinks they cant are dillusional .You have to have the money transferred into your bank account all the ato has to do is flag all the people that cash out bitcoins & when it hits your account they got you.Anonymous my arse It might be when your trading with others but when you cash out your toast .........if they really wanted you
     
  4. 1for1

    1for1 Well-Known Member

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    The harder crypto is to convert to fiat the more developed the alt world and trade in alt will get.. Classic case of govt unintended consequences..

    The whole idea is to create a barter economy without the need for fiat.. So the govt saying it will be taxed is confirmation that people want to keep building up crypto worlds free from govt intervention and meddling..

    Boom how you like that
     
  5. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Nice idea...

    ...but only true to an extent until all taxes are gone. Until a landowner can pay land tax in something other than fiat then convertibility is still needed. Governments have the geographic monopoly so need to somehow break free of the geographical taxes (extortion payments).
     
  6. JulieW

    JulieW Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Drink to forget:

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/shortcuts/2013/jun/23/britains-first-bitcoin-pub

     
  7. bordsilver

    bordsilver Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  8. 1for1

    1for1 Well-Known Member

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    Sure but BTC exists within the world i live so i wouldnt (right now) advocate OR have exclusive ownership of just BTC, in 2013 i get paid in fiat - i can then choose to convert this fiat into goods or services i wish, keeping a portion for fiat only costs incurred..

    Dont see how BTC changes the game here.. it should be a very similar concept to cashing out of paper and saving with gold/silver

    Artifical resistance will get nullified .. know a quote about great ideas whose time has come?.... Think big.. implement it in baby steps (incrementally),

    1for1
     
  9. RetardedMonkey

    RetardedMonkey Active Member Silver Stacker

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    Interesting.

    Lets see what comes of this heading into July and August
     
  10. goanna

    goanna Member Silver Stacker

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    I can't see the point of your post - you say exactly what I said but seem to think I said something different.
     
  11. renovator

    renovator Well-Known Member

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    The point was i was agreeing with you :p: I just gave some detail that you didnt
     
  12. boston

    boston Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    I think that at least one of the original intents of BitCoin, was to effectively trade/barter between like minded people who were jaded with the current system.

    With this mindset, cashing out through traditional BIS related banks is not an option and for all intents and purposes, anonymous.

    Only speculators would consider cashing out through the banking system.

    Just for the record I do not have any, or know how to operate under a BitCoin system.
     
  13. Eureka Moments

    Eureka Moments Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    Unexplained Wealth Laws are a worry.
     
  14. mmissinglink

    mmissinglink Active Member

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  15. pro$pector

    pro$pector New Member

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    +1

    "Dillusional" is what anyone is who thinks there isn't ways to make your cash out anonymous.

    There would be a whole swag of Silk Road sellers going down if anonymous cash outs weren't possible, but so far they've been untouchable.

    The Bitcoin discussions on this forum are endlessly amusing, in that so many people who know nothing about the subject seem to think they know it all. :lol:
     
  16. pro$pector

    pro$pector New Member

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    double post - edited.
     
  17. renovator

    renovator Well-Known Member

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    . The thing that amuses me with you guys is you think ur so anonymous but here you are telling anybody that will listen that u have bitcoins & made a motza with them .I wouldnt be surprised if there was members on here that worked for the ato lol Is it really that hard to find ur ip address then track you down :lol: bwuhahahahaha very funny indeed.Not that they would or if they really care but if they wanted they could

    So please do tell us how you can cash out here in oz anonomously without it going into your bank account . Is there a back alley somewhere that you can walk into with a balaclava & your pc & get cash ?or do u need to have it transferred into an institution ?.I am talking cash here not buying goods with them im sure you can buy goods no problem but im talking cashing out not bartering out ..
    Ive seen the guys explain how they are cashing out & it involves your bank details . So i think you need to enlighten the other guys too .
     
  18. RetardedMonkey

    RetardedMonkey Active Member Silver Stacker

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    I've seen people do face to face transactions for Bitcoins.

    One guy hands over money, one guy transfers Bitcoins on laptop/iPad to wallet address.

    Same way you'd do a goods transfer.
     
  19. pro$pector

    pro$pector New Member

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    First up, I personally don't care about anonominity so am happy to cash out via bank accounts (as most here are) and pay my taxes (although not all countries have capital gains tax remember). But others do care about being off the radar and it is entirely possible.

    As well as face to face transactions, there are services around (even in Australia), who will accept Bitcoin and then post you cash in the mail for it - risky yes, but I'll bet 99.99% of that mail doesn't get stolen in the post.

    As willrocks said above, he knows of plenty of BTC to Silver or Gold transactions that leave no bank trail - I've been involved in a few myself.

    There are many many other ways, some much more involved than the above and designed for much larger amounts. But I am going to (perhaps wrongly) assume you are not stupid and can do your own research since I don't need to be spending all day explaining it.

    I also suggest you take just 2 minutes to check into how hard it really is to mask your IP address (start with a quick read up on the TOR browser). :lol:
     
  20. renovator

    renovator Well-Known Member

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    But you cashed out through your bank account by your own admission in the bitcoin thread
     

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