I have done reseearch on this and decided pandas are the way to go

a) Yep, like toning - not everyone likes their coins toned.
b) Handling a graded coin is also much easier (no gloves required).
c) It is also far easier to transport a slabbed coin over a non-slabbed coin.

Pandas aren't just bullion, they are also numismatic - more so than Philly's, Maples, and Ferns.

Nothing wrong with Antique Chinese Coins.
Nothing wrong with stacking silver bullion.
Nothing wrong with MCCs/Pandas.
They have all made noticeable appreciations in the last 20years.

Grading is pretty objective (though there are occasional exceptions).
Grading opens your item to more potential buyers - since they may not need to see the coin in person, and can often rely on the grade. Review the auctions (Hosane, Champion, Stacks, etc), graded items achieve higher results almost every time.

Follow the money. The free-market has shown consistently that graded coins perform well.

Sure, if you have a crystal ball, buy silver when you know it is cheap.
However, just to compare how easy investing in Pandas has been:
2011 Pandas and Philly's, Maples, and Ferns were all about the same price (Pandas had a slight premium). Today, the 2011 Pandas are worth around $40-$50each, whereas the 2011 Philly's, Maples, and Ferns are only worth about $30.

 

I've seen pandas getting milk spots or toning while in slabs. So it raises the question of those MS69-MS70 that might get the spots in next 10, 15, 20 years (let alone 50, 100 years). All this will ruin premium down to ungraded level IMHO. That's what my crystal ball said. That's why I've sold all my nongraded and bought 3 nongraded for two graded pandas

As of pandas vs other bullion - I'd go for pandas.
2013 Pandas vs 2013 Horses - I went with horses!

 

Just verify they have been conserved--or do them yourself---none of my slabs have milk spots. Also, put some dessicant packets where there are stored--moisture is usually the culprit with milk spots

 

What do you think of slabbed pandas stored in a slab case and then in a safe but in a basement? Any chance of moisture getting to them? I don't want my coins getting spots although some have been conserved.

 

I have pandas, Canadian wildlife, ect
No milk spots on any,
Every pack of biscuits I eat has a little baggy of desiccant in it, throw these in with your stash.
I must have something like 40 of them dispersed between my stuff.

 

Wrong thread.

 

Do not buy slabbed modern semi-numismatic coins. Why throw your money away or put all your eggs in one basket betting on a single variety of semi-numismatic coinage to go up the most over time?

Number one- you can save money and buy more coins. Number two- modern BU coins are minted to such high standards a roll of 20 should mostly be MS69s or MS70s anyway. Number three- slabbed coins can still develop milk spots AFTER being slabbed.

Want to be pissed off? Buy a slabbed modern semi-numi at a premium, instead of three BU of the same coin, and pick that once perfect MS-70 slabbed coin up three months after you bought it to find milk spots starting to appear. Now your slabbed coin just automatically decreased at least 20% in value and will always be viewed as suspect. It has happened to me and I don't want it to happen to you.

Strategy- buy more semi-numi coins and purchase a variety to hedge you bet. If any develop milk spots you can easily sell it for little to no loss and get a replacement quickly and easily. In the future you can always have the variety of coin that really took off price wise graded yourself if that's the best way to maximize your profit.

 

Yeh, all my slabbed pandas got white spots...

 

Dang, seriously? What years? Ain't no way I'm going near Panadas bullion. That sucks. I bought a 2010 70 for 99.00, and it developed spots, sold it for 53.00...crushing.

 

Mine are 2010 and 2011 Pandas, all MS69, all milk spot (big spots)... Will not buy slabbed pandas anymore.

 

Do share some pics so that it will serve as a caution for those who are looking to collect pandas.

Personally I am interested in 5oz and kilo pandas, but am hesitant as their mirror surfaces seem so tempting for milkspots to form!

 

Im collecting pandas for more than 2 years.
First only bullion
After it ngc ms69
The secret is ncs first and later ngc
The old pandas 2008 and bellow rarely develop white spots

 

Where do you guys buy your graded coins? I was looking at buying a few, but I don't know where to start

 

I have a few 5oz pandas 2011, not slabbed ones, they all have been in really good condition, the mirror surface didn't have any sign of milk spots at all, perhaps I am lucky, heard that 5oz 2013 has big issue of milk spots.

 

Yeah. I've seen some milk spots even on those being sold online. The 5oz is a nice size especially for 3 bears, but I'm not a fan of milkspots at all!

 

Do milk spots really decrease the value since they are so common?

 

Put yourself as the buyer, 2 coins, 1 with milk spot, one without, which one will you buy if both are same price? What if the one with milk spot is marked 20% lower, tempted?

 

Yes, and yes, and yes. Thems are the facts.

 

Have just had about 20 go through myself, 7 stayed with me, all looked flawless. 2010 was the one of the only bad years for milkspots, and seeing them slabbed with those is only because people are too cheap to conserve them-ALWAYS CONSERVE!!!!

 

Conservation on high mintage coins is a waste of money, there is almost no way that you will make back that expense without a significant move in the metal price. I've bought, graded and sold hundreds of pandas, maybe not as many as Yennus or JC, but I have certainly had my fair share of disappointments with both the pandas developing white spots (bad QC in China on post-2010 coins) and NGC/NCS quality and consistency being very choppy.

I actually no longer have a NGC account because they nickel and dime you for everything, their grading consistency is non-existent, and they clearly provide favorable grades to high-volume dealers. These are my opinions, but I feel strongly about them.

I would only NCS coins that are rare, carry substantial premiums and have a very good chance of significant appreciation. Depending on how many coins you submit to NGC/NCS, after handling fees and round-trip shipping in the US, you will easily have fees of around $23-30 per coin, that's a lot of money to try to make up. The other thing is that it is getting increasingly harder to find OMP and capsule-only pandas worth grading, at least at the shows/dealers in my area. Don't mistake this rambling as me saying graded pandas are a bad investment, it's just that you need to be very critical of the coins you consider submitting for grading, and you need to run the numbers to see if it is actually worth the expense. If there is a slim chance of turning a profit, and a bigger chance of losing money if you get a low score, it's not worth it.