Paper vs Physical Price?

Discussion in 'Gold' started by JulieW, Mar 30, 2017.

  1. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    OK, you are confirming exactly what I thought. :rolleyes:

    Let me put the question to you as as simply as I can. :)

    What sources of information (links) do you have to back up such outrageous claims as these, regarding client accounts?: (your whole argument is pinned on these assumptions).
    PS: I'll ignore the comment regarding my "like" count as it is obvious you are an ignorant noob. ;)
     
  2. Paul

    Paul Member

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    I have already pointed you to the CFTC reports.

    They are prohibited by law from identifying the specific parties that the data is based on, but it is not difficult to deduce who some are, particularly the largest ones.

    I have spent numerous hours every day for the past 5 years studying this subject, and I write about CONCLUSIONS I HAVE MADE.

    I am not regurgitating anything I found on some link.

    If you don't like what I write, then ignore it.

    I am quite content with my understanding and trading results.

    As far as being a "noob", I studied economics at Sloan while Ben Bernanke was there working on his PhD. about 1978-9?

    Unlike Ben, however, I did a couple of engineering degrees at MIT as well.

    Hardly new to the game.
     
  3. Paul

    Paul Member

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    If you are seriously interested in reading about this, Ted Butler writes about it for a living and has put a few articles into the public domain where you can read them for free.

    I have seen a couple on Silver Doctors site, which is 90% plus garbage, but I scan it occasionally looking for what is not.
     
  4. Paul

    Paul Member

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    You are talking about PROPRIETARY TRADING ACCOUNT POSITIONS.

    Do you really think there is a link to those?????

    Just because it is not freely available public domain information with an Internet link to it does not mean that it is not real.
     
  5. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    No, I don't. Hence my questioning your specific knowledge regarding exactly who owns the accounts. ;)

    Oh really? :rolleyes:
    If it were fact, you would be able to verify.
    Just as I thought.... assumptions needed to vindicate your hopes and wishes.
    Have a nice day. :)
     
  6. Paul

    Paul Member

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    Neither the market nor this forum is a court of law.

    I don't have to prove anything to you, nor to anybody else.

    I suspect you are sitting on a pile of physical that is worth a lot less than you paid for it, and are looking to blame somebody else.

    "Manipulation..... If you want to continually subscribe to this idea then get out of precious metals. Only a fool would play a game that is completely rigged. As you still are in the game, I would say that you are not completely convinced of the manipulation ... "

    Why else would you haunt this forum with such comments?????

    Keep your stack, someday it will work out OK.

    Our stack is worth about what we paid for it in USD, but we did not buy in USD, do not think in USD, and do not live in USD.

    It is up over 15% in THB, but I don't really care.

    If all goes well, our daughter will inherit the entire stack and it will certainly be worth a lot more in the future than it is now

    I don't care if that is beyond my expiration date or not, as we are quite wealthy in other investments, but most of them bore me to tears to be honest.

    Yes, oak trees grow from acorns, but watching it is seriously boring.

    At 20 to 1, a $13 move in gold gets us 20% on the money invested.

    Never a dull moment!!!

    I am happy to play the game as it is.

    A few large banks can manipulate the market, and all I need to do is copy them.

    Life is easy, life is good :) !
     
  7. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    No, I didn't ask for proof, just for any available info that you based your statements on.
    Personal opinion equates to blind faith in this instance - but you would know this given you have a couple of engineering degrees from MIT. :rolleyes:
    Given the lack of available info, I still call BS.
    :)

    OMG. Ha ha.
    I suggest you read that sig again - your interpretation is a little off here too. o_O
    You really don't know me very well.
    ;)
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2017
  8. tolly_67

    tolly_67 Well-Known Member

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    It is all so easy........... until it isn't.
    Be careful Paul.
     
    wrcmad likes this.
  9. Paul

    Paul Member

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    Yes, I understand full well the dangers of futures trading.

    For perspective, the initial amount put into the game was about half a percent of family net worth at the time.

    Presently, it is about 2%, but that is all profits, as the "original capital" has been taken back out of the accounts involved many, many times over.

    I do it primarily for fun, and to stay active.

    The rest of our investments are TOTALLY BORING, as they should be for most of what people have at our age (I'm 62.)

    It has not all been fun. About a year and a half ago, maybe, we thought the latest smash was about over and flipped from short to long just before a $60 drop on a Monday morning that was a Chinese holiday.

    I was sitting at the computer when it happened.

    Wife was not happy about it, but took a couple of kilo bars to the local gold shop and pawned them for a month, sending the money to her brokers, but held the positions.

    (There are as many gold shops here as there are burger joints in the States.)

    She got her bars back a month later.
     
  10. The Patriot Mind

    The Patriot Mind New Member

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    Paper gold and vaults and comes etc are all like playing the cakewalk game with a hundred people and each time the music stops someone doesn't have a chair... this happens until only one chair is left and 1 person of the hundred who thought they "owned" gold somewhere whether on comes futures or bullion vaults or etfs is the only one who actually getphysical gold the rest was imaginary

    Paper gold is another bull crap banker/wall street shell game don't get involved
     
  11. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    No one owns gold on Comex futures.
    Educate yourself about the system before making misleading blanket statements and giving advice.
     
  12. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  13. The Patriot Mind

    The Patriot Mind New Member

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    If you take delivery you do own the gold period

    If everyone decided to take delivery ... there would be a lot of people with no,physical,gold

    Educate that :p
     
  14. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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    "If you take delivery..." is decidedly different to your previous statement: "of the hundreds who thought they "owned" gold..."

    Not possible.
    Firstly, only the short has the right to issue a Notice of Intention to Deliver. Long's can stand for physical delivery, if a Notice of Intention to Deliver is available to them.
    Thus, everyone can't decide to take delivery on a long, because COMEX doesn't work like that.
    Secondly, even if your whimsical fallacy was possible, only the current spot month is deliverable, and is covered multiple time by COMEX inventory, so everyone would get their gold and be happy little campers.
    Anyone who believes otherwise has been suckered by the permabulls.

    OK, here is your education:
    Comexodus: JPMorgan's Vault Is One Withdrawal Away From Running Out

    Done. :D
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
  15. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  16. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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  17. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    Value is what it's traded at, and I've seen it traded above, on and below spot.
    Spot, is just a moving reference, and trading sometimes follows it, and sometimes not.
    Simple reason is that those whoms trading the spot price movement is based on, don't need to be the same as those of others trading it, including indirect effects.

    Liquidity itself, comes at a price / risk. Being the risk related to dependency on third parties.
    If the goal is saving, stacking, avoiding theft by the central planning communists, who may suspend upto seize property held in commonly used depots (whether that is an electronic account at a bank or a locker at a bank or a reported to / approved by communists - bullion depot), then I'd say physical under direct control, unreported, unknown, scattered, is a safer option. Coming with a price / risk too: your management of it. At the very least, one can blame himself for errors, instead of powerless watching how third parties fill their pockets their easy way: from their chairs in front of their screens tickling their keyboards.
    Liquidity, is also a function of price. Dump your silver coins on the street with a price tag of zero and they'll be sold to the next passenger that passed to feed his sheep.
     
  18. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

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    How do you know?
    I only knew post mortem.
    Most on the Kitco forum back in 2011, didn't know it.
    They even didn't know about the existence of a futures market, let alone its purpose.
    Some people visit a bullion shop and order, unaware of who/what/why the figure on the price tag.
    They even don't see their purchase as "investment".
    They merely try an alternative for their previous method of saving, after realizing it had been a loss.
    The futures, and any derivative, market drives on your dumb dogs. If there weren't dumb dogs, they'd lose their existence reason.
    Why do you think there is such a high level of misleading 'round in these market places? From clubs like Zerohedge, Silver Doctors to central planning communists like central banks?
    To make, and keep the dogs dumb.
     
  19. wrcmad

    wrcmad Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

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