Is there Another Stock Market Crash Coming?

Discussion in 'Markets & Economies' started by Cinvalo, Jun 1, 2017.

Tags:
  1. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
    mmm....shiney! likes this.
  2. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Messages:
    18,676
    Likes Received:
    4,438
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Share market noob here:

    As the methods used to denominate the PE ratios have altered over time, would it make the assumptions you've arrived at from analysing the above chart invalid?
     
    Cinvalo likes this.
  3. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
    PE ratio = Price of a stock / Earning of a company.
    I think it Robert J. Sheller 's book Irrational Exuberance gives a more detail explanation regarding to his assumption.
    But again, this is a very good indicator.
     
  4. BuggedOut

    BuggedOut Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2015
    Messages:
    2,552
    Likes Received:
    977
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    New South Wales
    PE ratios are effectively related to interest rates. Low interest rates means capital chases yield on shares, driving prices up and PE ratios with it.

    Therefore record low interest rates leads to record high PE ratios.

    I'm not saying this is a good situation, nor that the market won't crash when interest rates normalise, just pointing out that historical metrics don't really apply. These are extraordinary circumstances.
     
    mmm....shiney! likes this.
  5. alor

    alor Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2011
    Messages:
    12,102
    Likes Received:
    3,877
    Trophy Points:
    113
    living example like Venezuela come to mind
    best performing stocks market
     
  6. bubblebobble2

    bubblebobble2 Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2012
    Messages:
    5,407
    Likes Received:
    3,510
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    P!MP land-Seedeneey
    nah... not gonna happen.. we have mining and housing BOOM!
     
  7. mmm....shiney!

    mmm....shiney! Administrator Staff Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Messages:
    18,676
    Likes Received:
    4,438
    Trophy Points:
    113
    But the regulations around reporting PE ratios and how they are calculated have changed over time. Therefore, I'm arguing that to use the historical correlation between PE ratios and past market crashes in drawing the conclusion Sheller has arrived at is not sound.
     
    Cinvalo likes this.
  8. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
    These are indicators that are flashing red light. If you revisit the chart from my article, there are at least 5 instances where the stock market crashes when the P/E ratio exceed 25, with the exception of the period around 1929 and 2000.

    Not saying the stock market will 100% crash in 2017. But, the probability is high, especially for the second half of the year.
     
    mmm....shiney! likes this.
  9. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
    I agree with you that the measures the earnings (E) of a company changes over time. It depends on how a company reports it. They might understate it for taxation purposes. But, it cannot be too far from the truth.
    The price of a share is what is the stock market trades.
    PE ratio is just the Price of a stock / Earning of a company.
     
    mmm....shiney! likes this.
  10. betterinvestmentthanshare

    betterinvestmentthanshare Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2014
    Messages:
    465
    Likes Received:
    181
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    South Australia
    Robert J Sheller? Does not exist at Yale.
    However, there is a Robert J Shiller and he is white :)
     
    Cinvalo likes this.
  11. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
  12. Radio8tiv

    Radio8tiv Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2016
    Messages:
    249
    Likes Received:
    127
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Townsville
    The Shiller P/E is only one indicator, others would be unemployment rates, manufacturing index, bond yield curve, etc the crash will come but not in 2017, but that's just my opinion
     
    mmm....shiney! and Cinvalo like this.
  13. Pirocco

    Pirocco Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2011
    Messages:
    4,872
    Likes Received:
    149
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    EUSSR
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    It doesn't look like the smartest are buying stocks now.
    Not if but when.
    A quite reliable indicator is the amount good news out there.
    The bigger, the closer that "when".
    What is the amount good news lately?
    This year so far, quite some increase here in my EU region.
    Based on comparisons with a couple past same stories, I'd say the next crisis is for september / october.
    After the flowers bees and sunshine vacations.
    A next question could be where in the world its "center of gravity" (just the start, in the end the central planning linked it all together along its money shifting) will be.
    Taking into account the monetary planning technique wherein currencies are kept within certain bands (snake in the tunnel), it will probably be in the US.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Dollar in its upper floating range.
    Euro in its lower floating range.
    Reversal time.
    Buy euro's.
    Sell dollars.
    A remaining question then is what the trigger (read: excuse) will be this time.
    Because usually some event serves as such.
    In the late nineties there was the millennium fear. The CBGA gentlemen agreement. NY's WTC hit by planes and subsequent collapses.
    The world didn't end then and won't end now.
    Just that it makes some people making wrong decisions (read: lose money).
    And that's the very purpose.
    Use some peoples savings to buy houses holidays and whatever.
    Scare them into willingness to pay whatever for whatever, after whatevers price was driven up.
    Just another repeat after rinse.
     
    Cinvalo likes this.
  14. Ipv6Ready

    Ipv6Ready Well-Known Member Silver Stacker

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2016
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,143
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    North Sydney
    Doesn't matter when he t crashes because it will climb even higher few years later.

    Don't be the chump who didn't buy investment properties waiting for a crash
     
  15. Cinvalo

    Cinvalo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    643
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    NSW
    A crash can be a crisis as well as an opportunity. It can make you get rich a whole lot faster.
     
  16. clear

    clear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,301
    Likes Received:
    242
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    WA
    go hard don't be a chump
     
  17. Radio8tiv

    Radio8tiv Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2016
    Messages:
    249
    Likes Received:
    127
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Townsville
    That's right, two asx codes to jump on when everything crashes is BEAR and BBUS
     

Share This Page